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thewilliam
17 Feb 2013 - 12:36 PM


Quote: That's true but your analogy doesn't really work in my opinion (and I am always right, as you will have noticed Tongue)

I had a favourite printer but he worked with my negative and made the best of it or re-interpreted it. That's the RAW and he's making the jpg, would be the analogy.

Your analogy is more akin to giving the RAW to the printer who, having printed it, throws the negative away.



In our workflow, the original is never thrown away. I was taught NEVER to work on the original file but to start by making a copy. We make JPEGs from the RAW.

Last Modified By thewilliam at 17 Feb 2013 - 12:36 PM
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lemmy
lemmy  61676 forum posts United Kingdom
17 Feb 2013 - 2:14 PM


Quote: In our workflow, the original is never thrown away. I was taught NEVER to work on the original file but to start by making a copy. We make JPEGs from the RAW.

Yes and that's the way Lightroom works, of course. But when you shoot just jpg in the camera, you have effectively thrown away the negative, the original information and are left with the doctored version.

Because of the way noise reduction in software has improved, I have digital pix several years old on which I can improve the noise level hugely using modern techniques. With jpg you've ditched that possibility.

Paul Morgan
Paul Morgan e2 Member 1214405 forum postsPaul Morgan vcard England6 Constructive Critique Points
17 Feb 2013 - 6:02 PM


Quote: Yes and that's the way Lightroom works, of course. But when you shoot just jpg in the camera, you have effectively thrown away the negative, the original information and are left with the doctored version

Not if you shoot jpeg and Raw, your throwing nothing away.


Quote: I had a favourite printer but he worked with my negative and made the best of it or re-interpreted it. That's the RAW and he's making the jpg, would be the analogy

Depends on your your printer Smile

Its much better to learn how to make correctly exposed negatives, without the need of a good printer to come along and save your work.

A lot of us started with just a camera and used labs, then at some point many of us set up a darkroom to squeeze every little out and print to our own like.

lemmy
lemmy  61676 forum posts United Kingdom
17 Feb 2013 - 7:42 PM


Quote: Not if you shoot jpeg and Raw, your throwing nothing away.

Paul, I explicitly say that WHEN YOU JUST SHOOT JPEG IN THE CAMERA. No photographer alive hasn't made a mistake - then you do need a printer. Of course it's much better to make correctly exposed negatives. It's better to drive without crashes but it still happens. It's called human error.

I did a year in the darkroom exclusively as part of my photographic training and have always done my own printing when I wanted the very best results, including colour printing.

Paul Morgan
Paul Morgan e2 Member 1214405 forum postsPaul Morgan vcard England6 Constructive Critique Points
17 Feb 2013 - 8:09 PM


Quote: I did a year in the darkroom exclusively as part of my photographic training and have always done my own printing when I wanted the very best results, including colour printing

The fun days Smile

lemmy
lemmy  61676 forum posts United Kingdom
17 Feb 2013 - 8:47 PM


Quote: The fun days

I think that what was fun was that you could develop a skill and be proud of it and enjoy it. Now, a computer can do it on your behalf of you but people still seem to be proud of it.

I don't think they are the same thing but you can't go back in time.

Arthur Koestler summed it up in one of his books. "There are two ways of getting to the top of a mountain. You can climb it from the base to the top. Or you can be carried to the top by Sherpas. The mistake is to think that the view from the top is the same".

Some people understand that, some don't. Discussing something on this site recently, I realised that what some people call manual, I call automatic. There's no bridging that gap.

Paul Morgan
Paul Morgan e2 Member 1214405 forum postsPaul Morgan vcard England6 Constructive Critique Points
17 Feb 2013 - 8:51 PM


Quote: I don't think they are the same thing but you can't go back in time

You could but would you want too.

I had a conversation with an old friend recently, he was going on about processing films, saying he wouldn`t know were to get all the chemicals now.

I pointed out he had almost everything needed in his pantry except vitamin C Smile

Last Modified By Paul Morgan at 17 Feb 2013 - 8:54 PM
lemmy
lemmy  61676 forum posts United Kingdom
17 Feb 2013 - 8:58 PM


Quote: You could but would you want too.

No. not really. I think I've lived through a golden age of western society. Never had to fight a war, brought up in a council house but never hungry.

When I left school had a choice of jobs and got a fabulous one that's taken me all over the world and enabled me to retire at 55.

I don't want to go back on anything, it could only be less good. All that worries me is that I'll wake up and it was all a dream.

Paul Morgan
Paul Morgan e2 Member 1214405 forum postsPaul Morgan vcard England6 Constructive Critique Points
18 Feb 2013 - 12:37 AM


Quote: I think I've lived through a golden age of western society

Where you at Tessa road during the early festival years Smile Smile

1972
Headliners: Curved Air, The Faces, Ten years After
Weekend tickets: 2.00
Friday: 1.00. Saturday: 1.75. Sunday: 1.25
The festival, now known as the National Jazz, Blues, Folk and Blues Festival, goes ahead at Richfield Avenue, Reading and the top act is the mighty Ten Years After (shurely shome mishtake?). The sun is blazing and police while away spare hours arresting nude swimmers in the Thames. The line-up includes Johnny Otis, The Faces and Genesis. John Peel and Jerry Floyd are the comperes.

lemmy
lemmy  61676 forum posts United Kingdom
18 Feb 2013 - 10:28 AM


Quote: Where you at Tessa road during the early festival years

Yes covered various festivals for the London Evening News where I was a staffer. Did the two Isle of Wight festivals with Bob Dylan and Jimi Hendrix, loads of them Hard work 16 hours a day but lots of fun.

I was a staffer on the Reading Evening Post in Tessa Road from 1965 to 1967. Lived in Caversham. Great area to live, used to go drinking in Sonning and all the Thames pubs. I used Pentax 35mm, Canon rangefinder and Rollei gear at that time.

Paul Morgan
Paul Morgan e2 Member 1214405 forum postsPaul Morgan vcard England6 Constructive Critique Points
18 Feb 2013 - 6:33 PM

Those festivals even hard there own unique smell, totally different to modern festivals Smile

kathrynlouise
kathrynlouise e2 Member 2364 forum postskathrynlouise vcard United Kingdom1 Constructive Critique Points
24 Feb 2013 - 9:51 PM

Hi. I also have the nikon P510 and i love it. My passion is wildlife photography and its served me well so far, still things to learn.
Have found everyone i've come into contact wih on here fabulous and without their help and knowledge i know i wouldn't have progressed as much as i have Grin

Kathryn

Jestertheclown
24 Feb 2013 - 10:04 PM

Kathryn,
I really must reply to your PM!

kathrynlouise
kathrynlouise e2 Member 2364 forum postskathrynlouise vcard United Kingdom1 Constructive Critique Points
25 Feb 2013 - 8:02 AM


Quote: Kathryn,
I really must reply to your PM!

I'm waiting Bren lol Tongue

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