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Current gallery trends...


ade_mcfade e2
10 15.1k 216 England
21 Apr 2011 9:11AM

Quote:The trick is finding a way to expand the EC HC gallery, without compromising quality.


I don't think you can Pete - it's doing what it says on the tin now. So long as people accept that its your choice (being the editor) and you are unbiased, I can't really see there being a problem - sure I'm sure we all get a bit disappointed when a shot we think is a cracker doesn't get the gong, but that's life.

The GEA gives the alternative view

The RC is the "facebook like" type award

So it's all covered.

My biggest worry is the lack of views at the moment - some shots are only getting 10-20 views. In the past, even the "EPZ unfriendly" stuff would get 50+ views. Kinda puts you off uploading anything more unusual; what's the point if no one's looking at it?

Probably time to get back doing hundreds of comments to get that following back, eh ? Wink

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SlowSong e2
6 4.8k 29 England
21 Apr 2011 9:14AM
I think there's a very good mix on EPZ and I've certainly tried many different subjects in an attempt to find my own "genre". Unfortunately I don't seem to be able to specialise, but I don't mind that at all as I get bored doing the same thing all the time. I looked at 1x but found it a bit exclusive, although a very high standard is required. Flickr is just a mess and other sites just don't have the "feelgood" factor that I find here.

Apart from the photography, I do like the interaction with other photographers and the fun side, which is why I'm staying put. But I'd be very surprised if I ever got an EC because only certain sorts of genres seem to get that accolade, albeit they are excellent and deserve it and mine don't, yet. I'm not in it for the glory though, It's just fun to share images. I think there's something here for everyone. The same sorts of images are bound to crop up, the same with printed magazines, so I don't know why people are surprised by this happening on EPZ.
Smile
whipspeed e2
10 4.1k 22 United Kingdom
21 Apr 2011 9:33AM

Quote:I don't think you can Pete - it's doing what it says on the tin now. So long as people accept that its your choice (being the editor) and you are unbiased, I can't really see there being a problem - sure I'm sure we all get a bit disappointed when a shot we think is a cracker doesn't get the gong, but that's life.


Agree, it's the editors choice & Pete is the editor. I think that by expanding it, that it would cheapen it somehow, make it less to strive for and there is always the HC gallery for those that are just a bit under.

Also as Ade says, there is the GEA for an alternative view and the RC award which is given by the members and also lets not forget user awards, which we can all give.

I know my main genre cycling photography is not always that interesting to non cycling folk, but I was really chuffed this week to get an RC and a user award on a shot that I thought was probably the best of the group I'd put up from a race, it makes you feel that you are going in the right direction.
21 Apr 2011 11:29AM

Quote:Is a decent comment not enough then Koen, its reached the point when I pretty much don`t vote any more. Seems some only appreciate votes from there circle of little chums, if your not in that circle then your vote holds no merit, and your looked upon as vote fishing.

Lol why bother


good point Paul... there's another expectation out the window Wink



Quote:Koen, I can't see how Pete could stop certain genre uploaded on the site.

I'm not suggesting he should Cole.


Quote:With 1x, there are also certain genres which are more popular.

last 50 published photos on 1x :
1. beautiful woman
2. (abstract) landscape
3. macro (bug in flower)
4. DM
5. landscape (b&w)
6. macro bugs
7. street
8. portrait girl with flower (b&w)
9. architecture (not sure if DM used... seems like it)
10. landscape
11. humor/portrait
12. nude (b&w)
13. landscape
14. bugs on flower
15. bird
16. documentary/environmental portrait
17. DM
18. landscape/night photography
19. Portrait man (more into 'mood')
20. Portrait musicians within landscape (hard to put under a category sometimes Wink )
21. DM (creative edit - b&w)
22. DM
23. landscape/architecture
24. landscape/nature
25. documentary/environmental portrait
26. hmmm... shot of bull in action (hard to categorize)
27. landscape (with person-b&w)
28. landscape/cityscape
29. conceptual (girl on swing)
30. architecture
31. landscape/mood (it says creative edit, but not sure)
32. landscape (with person)
33. landscape
34. documentary/environmental portrait (b&w)
35. portrait (b&w)
36. bugs (macro)
37. landscape
38. documentary
39. bird
40. nude/beautiful woman (b&w)
41. macro (falling droplet)
42. night photography (landscape)
43. beautiful woman
44. landscape
45. portrait (toned/b&w)
46. DM/humor
47. documentary
48. landscape
49. sport/action (b&w)
50. landscape/abstract

there's a difference between less popular and almost or completely obsolete Cole. it the list above there is balance. Perhaps not quite a perfect balance, but, balance. That balance has gone completely missing on epz. In which regard you can compare epz to 500x, where the balance is also non-existant and has tipped over completely towards 'beautiful woman'


Quote:EPZ is always changing with season. Maybe it is spring time now and plenty of wildlife and animals and insects to shoot?

see list above : guess it's not spring in the rest of the world Wink


Quote:I'm really not sure how you can even begin to compare 1x with epz. I got bored of looking at 1x ages ago, its style was too similar in what it accepts

lol... well I did mention that I loved the sense of humor on epz Wink


Quote:, however I've just gone and had another look and the standard seems to have dropped considerably.

standard was never at question here K, but you must be glad then that 1x is finally starting to convert to epz standards Wink


Quote:Not quite true as far as I know 1x has a filtered set of genres - you won't see excellent bird on stick photos or sunsets for example and those are still forms of serious photography. And also it's pictures let through that the "judges like" So if you like an extended EC HC choice with some bias to certain subjects.

1x when you select 'nature'
notice the birds on a stick Wink
notice the balance within the genre?
1x when you select landscape
notice the sunsets?
notice the balance within the genre?

photos submitted on 1x mostly go to member screening. members there are the same as members are here, regardless if they pay or don't pay. The crew (which I suppose you mean when referring to 'judges') seldom interferes in the screening results. so if there is some bias towards certain subjects, then this bias comes from members. Just to get that bit out of the way. Besides, I find it a little ironic when looking at the 2 lists above that you want to focus on bias on 1x.
Quality-wise you could well compare publications on 1x with your HC/EC gallery Pete. But, the HC/EC gallery represents the opinion of one man (good chap btw), whereas on 1x the published photos represent the opinion of the whole community.

Not saying you must turn this site into a 1x-clone. Just rectifying some 'wrong ideas' that go around about that site. 'myths' that always seem pop up as false arguments when epz starts getting criticized. In short, when compared to (the) epz (community), (the) 1x (community) is not biased at all. 500x is so biased towards nude/pretty women/fashion photography that they have to invent a new word for it. and the same goes for epz. Just replace nude/pretty women/fashion photography with landscape and nature (mostly birds, bees, flowers) photography.
SlowSong e2
6 4.8k 29 England
21 Apr 2011 11:44AM
When I go through the gallery here and spot a good image (IMO) I'll go to that person's personal gallery to have a look at their portfolio overall. Everyone has off days, or just wants to put up a personal image which may not necessarily reflect their level of skill or experience, and I've discovered quite a few new faves this way. I'm getting so many faves now that there're almost as many images in there as there are in the main gallery. And although I do have favourites I do go through the main gallery too and comment time permitting. I wonder how many people on here who moan about stuff actually bother to look at everything or just like moaning because they don't get the recognition they think they deserve.
21 Apr 2011 11:49AM

Quote:I wouldn't say it's a little bubble, more a very large bubble - 85% are happy with the way the gallery works. What I've always wanted is to keep that 85% happy while working a way to encourage the 15% element to grow so they join the 85% happy group.


A large bubble only on epz Pete. And exactly because that 85% is so blissfully happy within their bubble and for a big part ignorant of anything that goes on outside that bubble, things won't change, regardless of what you try. So just give the bubble another name, one it deserves, one that actually covers the content. and then everyone can bubble along happily ever after Wink
Stenno e2
8 11 England
21 Apr 2011 12:55PM

Quote:Sounds like your seeking some sycophantic adulation


Nah, you don't know how wrong you are my friend?
If I was on the receiving end of the kinda thing I believe you are suggesting, I would feel quite sick to the stomach!

I just enjoy what I do, spending many a happy hour whilst doing it?
The 'genre' I work in actually costs me a lot of money, itself being a bind at times but hey ho!
I do all this because I love it and if it's accepted and received in a positive way, all the better.

I always endeavour to achieve the highest quality I can, which might work at times, other times not....yet the effort is always constant.
After uploading an image to this site, keeping in mind the time it's taken from the outset to the final product, to be greeted with very little or no interest at all, is kinda frustrating at best?
It may simply be a case that people don't like the image, although strangely with it being of a very similar look/feel to an image upload within a previous day or so, it gets me thinking.

I made the point (which I stand by) after viewing the work of several people here on this site who, despite whatever image they upload, 'always' without exception have this sycophantic appraisal....it's quite sad in a way!
You see, the viewer 'never' looks at the image, they don't need to because it's by 'so and so', it just has to be amazing!
Well very often it isn't...as an example a 'named' guy uploaded a portrait some days ago, for me it was nothing special, apart from my confusion due to the look/hair/make-up/pose which his camera club friends seemed to 'die for', the airbrushing (in particular along the girl's jaw line) was done very badly and the imperfections (edited ones, not hers) are appalling!
It received well in excess of 100 votes, an EC, a HC and probably a bouquet and a box of chocolates to boot! All rather mystifying when I'm told 'only' the best, most outstanding images receive the attention, plaudits and awards? Heyyyyy, do me a favour!

Anyway that's enough from me, I've said all I have to say!
Nigeyboy e2
6 537 United Kingdom
21 Apr 2011 1:10PM
Stay with me on this one!! I ran the London Marathon on Sunday. It was my second one in as many years, and this year, despite the 21/22c temperatures, a twisted ankle at mile 18 I finished in 5hrs, 10mins and 9 seconds. I bettered my 2010 time by 17 minutes. Although I didn't hit my planned 4hrs 30min time i had planned, i still got through it in one peice!!

The marathon is one of the few races in the world, where the 'fun runner' starts at the same time as the best runners on the planet. This race has probably the biggest cross section of people you could imagine - from those that take 2hrs and 5mins to those that press on despite the pain, and do it in 10hrs and 5mins.

What would the london Marathon be without those tens of thousands of fun runners? Would 2 million Londoners come out to cheer on a small pack of just elite racers?

Ephotozine could be compared the same - a broad cross section of people - from those that have just picked up a camera for the first time, to those that have been pro for years. I can't really understand the negative comments that I've read here. Its a shame when someone like Pete puts together an amazing and varied site such as this.

I would think that newcomers to the site are here to pick up tips and tricks form the pros, to help them improve their technique. I've been here long enough not to pay attention to clicks and votes. I upload if I feel I have a nice image to show - if it gets only 3 clicks then I not too bothered. One day I may get an award, but thats not what I'm here for.

Pete - keep on with what your doing mate. I'm in the 85% of 'fun runners'. The 15% of the elite that can't be pleased whatever you do, can either like it or lump it.
whipspeed e2
10 4.1k 22 United Kingdom
21 Apr 2011 2:32PM
Sorry, Geoff, but your last post really does sound like sour grapes. It's not as if you don't get a decent amount of votes on your work and you've had a few awards and looking at them and your portfolio I'd say that yes, the best have been awarded.
Looking at your recent work, yes they are very, very well taken, the PS work is well done, the models are extremely attractive and well posed. But to me, they just lack that spark of something extra that stands out in some of your previous work, they are just models against a plain background, whereas some of your other work seems more creative & just have that spark of something to them.
I really hope you don't take this the wrong way, it's only my opinion after all.
There will always be people who vote for their friends, it's human nature. Personally I go though the gallery and look at thumbnails that interest me and vote or comment as I feel, but I don't normally look at who has taken them. There are some portfolios that I do look at regularly as well, because the work appeals to me. So, I for one, DO look at the image and I don't think that I'm alone in that.
spaceman e2
10 5.2k 3 Wales
21 Apr 2011 5:09PM
People complain too much.
Stenno e2
8 11 England
21 Apr 2011 5:26PM

Quote:Sorry, Geoff, but your last post really does sound like sour grapes. It's not as if you don't get a decent amount of votes on your work and you've had a few awards and looking at them and your portfolio I'd say that yes, the best have been awarded.
Looking at your recent work, yes they are very, very well taken, the PS work is well done, the models are extremely attractive and well posed. But to me, they just lack that spark of something extra that stands out in some of your previous work, they are just models against a plain background, whereas some of your other work seems more creative & just have that spark of something to them.
I really hope you don't take this the wrong way, it's only my opinion after all.
There will always be people who vote for their friends, it's human nature. Personally I go though the gallery and look at thumbnails that interest me and vote or comment as I feel, but I don't normally look at who has taken them. There are some portfolios that I do look at regularly as well, because the work appeals to me. So, I for one, DO look at the image and I don't think that I'm alone in that.




Although after saying enough from me I just couldn't resist coming back to answer this? I'd also like to add before going any further and to back up your wishes that no, I haven't taken this the wrong way?
As we are all aware, photography is subjective and we will never please everyone all of the time, if people like what I do then that's great, if they don't that's fine too, nobody died Smile
You obviously take a lot of pleasure from shooting guys on bikes. I don't but that's fine as it's entirely your choice and the images appear to be serving you very well Smile

Nothing to do with 'sour grapes' at all, along with you and the rest of the members of this site, I to have the right to an opinion, viewpoint and the right to decide what I either like or don't like?
What I do find quite interesting is your observation that my most recent work seemingly features 'just models against a plain background'. However it must be pointed out that the great majority of my images 'including' half of my awarded photographs, also feature 'just models against a plain background', looking alarmingly similar in content, so in effect your point falls flat?

If I choose to work with models, apart from location work an alternative is to work with them in a studio...most of which feature 'plain backgrounds'...where my attention/effort almost always centre around the girl in the picture, thus avoiding props, clutter and the rest of it.

I'm actually quite proud of the awards my images have received, it's very satisfying and refreshing to realise what we do is not in vain Smile
I do pay a lot of attention to detail etc. during the editing process, usually in an attempt to create something special?
They are not produced however like some HC/EC images I see where it's patently obvious little thought or effort has gone into them, or in some cases are little more than snapshots!
I just found it surprising when told only the best and most outstanding images on this site, are picked out?

Hopefully a reasonable reply but if you see it as sour grapes yet again then so be it, again that's your choice!
whipspeed e2
10 4.1k 22 United Kingdom
21 Apr 2011 5:44PM
No I don't see your reply as sour grapes, it's interesting discussion and as you rightly say we never please everyone all the time.
You should be proud of the images that have awards, they are very, very good and I did vote on a few of them at the time, I wish I had the knack of being able to visualise a pose for a model.
You just seemed unhappy that your latest work hadn't been picked above other work recently. As for the plain background, it is probably more that the models in the awarded shots seem to have more of a spark and contact with the lens or that indefinalble something that makes you look twice at someone, rather than your photography having changed, difficult to explain how one feels when viewing an image of a model. But I was trying to describe how I felt about the shots and why I thought that maybe they had missed out on awards.
Grampy e2
5 507 71 England
21 Apr 2011 5:57PM
Very few of my shots get awards on this site ,in fact only one ! but does it matter , as long as I THINK I know what I'm doing and I like my shots, that really is enough. I have always been amazed by the great quality of some of the work on EPZ, most of it not voted for and no awards, as long as we look at them and give an honest opinion, is all that matters .
Phillip
Alan_Coles e2
9 176 11 Wales
21 Apr 2011 6:43PM
I think the increase in wildlife is misleading.

Sure people are taking more quality images of animals that are wild but most of the quality shots (as you call them) are actually captive bred animals and when the tog ticks the box they are ticking the wrong one.

Its funny to see these threads started by Pete or "others" and from the 1st post your know where they are going to end up...no matter how you start the topic and what feedback you expect it will invariably come around to the awards / votes etc.

Couple of points to note. Someone mentioned more activity from Pete on people's images (the HC/EC ones anyway) I thought when one of these threads was started a little while ago - just after xmas I think ? I thought the Editor was going to try and comment on each award briefly to give people an idea of what he found enjoyable about the image? I only come across occasional images that have been awarded (because I got sick of seeing the same old....)anyway, I haven't witnessed much of the input from Pete. I know you are busy Pete but you do a lot of input in the forums so a few lines on awards shouldn't be too difficult?

Prior to the new "slower" version the site was to be revamped with exciting new things happening - well, thats how it was being portrayed in the forums at the time - well some time in now I can't say I have witnessed or been inspired to go in search of these new things? It doesn't feel new and improved. Not knocking the changes just saying what I think. You say there are more changes afoot Pete but I think the problem might be getting those things over to the people on the site and in such a way that excites people to want to use / find them? I don't know the answer to be honest but this is my honest view on the site.

Picking up for a bit on your thread about Faves a little while ago. I know you went at on at length to say that certain people wern't in your faves etc but that does not stop them being your faves...the very fact that multiple awards are credited to these people - based on your selection of them - gives them a favoured view...not intentionally I'm sure Wink that's just how it is.
Trooper and some others mentioned having a pro style gallery for people to aspire to... I'm not sure if another gallery would be the answer but I think if people attain a certain number of awards from yourself then their work should be automically be considered of a standard that you don't really have to give them another award. I would say say give them a tag in their user name (semi pro / pro) etc and as long as the tag was unique a gallery could be compiled very easily without need for a stand alone - or am wrong in my thinking ? I am sure the good togs will be striving for your favour by getting more quality images on the galleries. I would say though this would really be have to be earned by making the *pro title* a real feather in the togs cap?

On a more personal level I am now looking at growing studio backgrounds in my garden rather than trees...Wink

Weird...whilst I was typing this the screen kept scrolling as if someone was reading it????????
Alan_Coles e2
9 176 11 Wales
21 Apr 2011 6:45PM
Oh menat to add a note to Geoff (Stenno) ....I look at your work but don't comment or vote...the vote is pointless imo and I am not really equipped to make dashing comments on the genre just to say though I think it is quality stuff.

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