Login or Join Now

Upload your photos, chat, win prizes and much more

Username:
Password:
Remember Me

Can't Access your Account?

New to ePHOTOzine? Join ePHOTOzine for free!

Like 0

D-lighting pros and cons?

Join Now

Join ePHOTOzine, the friendliest photography community.

Upload photos, chat with photographers, win prizes and much more for free!

New PortraitPro 12 SALE + 10% OFF code EPZROS814
oldblokeh
oldblokeh  3794 forum posts United Kingdom
17 May 2012 - 6:46 AM

I could not find any way of making ViewNX display the two examples above to appear the same way. It's all very well calling it the 'default processing', but if you cannot then adjust the settings in the software to return the viewed image to a non-D-lighting state, then it is just as if the raw image had been altered.

Sponsored Links
Sponsored Links 
17 May 2012 - 6:46 AM

Join ePHOTOzine for free and remove these adverts.

JohnParminter
17 May 2012 - 7:19 AM


Quote: Let's get one thing absolutely clear - in-camera settings such as Active-D Lighting DOES NOT have any affect whatsoever on the Raw files captured by the sensor.

However, if you use Nikon's proprietary software - such as NX2 - then the default processing applied to the Raw file by the software on download will reflect any in-camera adjustments. That will not happen in Lightroom or ACR.

But the distinction is important, and seems to confuse a lot of people. The Raw file is not affected by in-camera settings but the post-processing might be, depending upon the software you use.

Yes, most of us above have been saying that, not all though.


Quote: But the point, in relation to the OP query, is that there is no purpose in using Active-D when shooting in Raw as the Raw file will contain all of the dynamic range that the sensor is capable of capturing and that detail can be brought out whatever processing regime you follow.

I agree there is no point to use ACR when the actual scene is within the DR of what the sensor can capture, I don't turn it on in this instance. But I do believe there is a use for ACR when shooting in RAW if the exposure is still outside of the sensors DR even when I have used 5 stops of ND graduated filter, which is what I have also been saying from the start. Leftforum, you may even disagree with this method but I find it useful and an advantage and that is why I offered the advice to the OP.

The disadvantge for me is the slightly flat looking shadows which I can either live with or tweak to suit in processing but this does not outweigh the advantage that I find when I use it.

The OP can take or leave the advice offered by any of us.

LenShepherd
LenShepherd e2 Member 62460 forum postsLenShepherd vcard United Kingdom
17 May 2012 - 8:15 AM


Quote: Let's get one thing absolutely clear - in-camera settings such as Active-D Lighting DOES NOT have any affect whatsoever on the Raw files captured by the sensor.


Sorry, this is not right if you use Nikon software.
Taking Capture NX2 as an example you can change D lighting in a RAW file between off, low, normal, high and extra high (though a D90 might not have the extra high option) in the RAW file camera settings options.
I am sure you can do this with free to download View NX as well.
It may be that some other software discards Nikon's D-Lighting, sharpening, colour balance, colour saturation, noise reduction etc selected when shooting RAW, and reverts to the original RAW Capture. This is one reason why some other software can often work faster than Capture NX2.
Digressing using Capture NX2 most of these effects and others can be applied locally to any part of the image in seconds.

JohnParminter
17 May 2012 - 8:50 AM

Len, I think Leftforum was actually saying this, clarified in his/her second sentence.

I think we are all now in agreement that you can use ACR in camera on a RAW file, it may only actually be applied when converting from NEF to JPG or TIFF in NX2 though or to the NEF file in camera (I don't actually know but that bit is irrelevant to me as long as it is applied eventually in the resultant TIFF file).

Leftforum's point is whether you would actually need to use ACR with NEF capture, he/she doesn't think it is necessary. I find a benefit in using them in combination on occasion.

Just two differing opinions which the OP can choose to use or ignore.

Last Modified By JohnParminter at 17 May 2012 - 9:55 AM
Jestertheclown
17 May 2012 - 9:14 AM


Quote: A RAW file is completely un processed

I'm following this thread as I was always under the impression that RAW files were just that - RAW, as in untouched, so I'm finding the responses here interesting.

There's a similar(ish) thread running here.

JohnParminter
17 May 2012 - 10:07 AM

Jester,

The other thread is very similar regarding in camera settings and NEF shooting.

I set contrast, saturation and sharpness in camera as well as ADL sometimes.

All these parameters are either carried separately with the NEF file or applied to the NEF file in camera (don't know but makes no difference to me) and are viewable and changeable in NX2.

When I save the NEF file as a TIFF or JPG then all the parameters I have selected in camera are embedded in the TIFF file which is all that matters to me.

During taking the NEF and viewing its representation in camera or on my monitor I see all th eeffects of setting the parameters in camera or if I change them in NX2.

So, it is irrelevant to me whether the NEF file is processed or unprocessed up to the point of saving as a TIFF, I just know all the in camera settings I want are in the final TIFF.

Whoever uses a Nikon in RAW and NX2 will know what I'm on about, hopefully....

Folk using Nikons in RAW then converting in Lightroom may not appreciate the benefits of using NX2 or understand the points I'm trying to make.

Smile

Last Modified By JohnParminter at 17 May 2012 - 10:19 AM
oldblokeh
oldblokeh  3794 forum posts United Kingdom
17 May 2012 - 10:17 AM


Quote:
All these parameters are either carried separately with the NEF file or applied to the NEF file in camera (don't know but makes no difference to me) and are viewable and changeable in NX2.



Here's the rub: ViewNX will *NOT* allow you to change the camera's D-lighting parameter. You are stuck with what you shot and the D-lighting parameter you set, so if you made the wrong decision, tough luck unless you fork out for other software.

Jestertheclown
17 May 2012 - 10:26 AM

Thanks John,
Personally, I use a Sony so whatever Nikons (or Canons, in that other thread) do with their RAW files doesn't directly affect me but I'm interested to know how all of these things work.

JohnParminter
18 May 2012 - 12:03 AM


Quote: All these parameters are either carried separately with the NEF file or applied to the NEF file in camera (don't know but makes no difference to me) and are viewable and changeable in NX2.



Here's the rub: ViewNX will *NOT* allow you to change the camera's D-lighting parameter. You are stuck with what you shot and the D-lighting parameter you set, so if you made the wrong decision, tough luck unless you fork out for other software.

Indeed, that is why I use ViewNX to view files and NX2 to convert the NEF files.

Pat_Stones
18 May 2012 - 12:18 AM


Quote: Folk using Nikons in RAW then converting in Lightroom may not appreciate the benefits of using NX2 or understand the points I'm trying to make

It's the same with Canon's DPP, it 'sees' features in the raw file which other software doesn't appear to. It also stores your changes (including cloning) to the raw file, I don't know of any third-party software that does that.

Pat_Stones
18 May 2012 - 12:21 AM


Quote: Let's get one thing absolutely clear - in-camera settings such as Active-D Lighting DOES NOT have any affect whatsoever on the Raw files captured by the sensor.

You're not quite right because that information has to be passed to the computer somehow so it must be embedded in the raw file.

User_Removed
18 May 2012 - 6:22 AM

Only in the way that EXIF data is attached. It does not affect the way the image is digitised in the Raw file.

User_Removed
18 May 2012 - 6:26 AM

....also somewhat surprised at the rather naive comments regarding NX2 v. Lightroom.

Sorry Guys - I prefer to have total control in the way that Lightroom (or ACR) allows, rather than be dictated to by some numpty software engineer subcontracted by Nikon.

But it's horses for courses. The proprietory Nikon (or Canon) software might be ideal for users who have less creative flair. Nothing wrong with that. Indeed, those are the very users who are likely to be attracted by "in-camera" settings and stuff such as "scene modes", etc.. Again, horses for courses.

Carabosse
Carabosse e2 Member 1139395 forum postsCarabosse vcard England269 Constructive Critique Points
18 May 2012 - 3:47 PM


Quote: I prefer to have total control in the way that Lightroom (or ACR) allows, rather than be dictated to by some numpty software engineer subcontracted by Nikon

Or indeed Olympus's RAW converter. I tried it once whilst waiting for Adobe to update. I didn't try it again - I shot JPEG for a few days instead! Wink

strawman
strawman  1022006 forum posts United Kingdom16 Constructive Critique Points
18 May 2012 - 4:15 PM


Quote: The proprietory Nikon (or Canon) software might be ideal for users who have less creative flair.

Have you tried DPP, it has a number of RAW controls like curves etc, plus the individual controls are there and it often does a better job of RAW conversion than Adobe do. Never used NX2 so no idea there, but I have used Lightroom and DPP and would say DPP has a few things going for you if you have a Canon camera. Its a long way ahead of the RAW tool elements ships with, but not as good as C1.

Last Modified By strawman at 18 May 2012 - 4:17 PM

Add a Comment

You must be a member to leave a comment

Username:
Password:
Remember me:
Un-tick this box if you want to login each time you visit.