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Dead 5DII - any suggestions?

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ChrisV
ChrisV  7663 forum posts United Kingdom26 Constructive Critique Points
24 Oct 2012 - 5:05 PM

I've had my 5DII for maybe a tad longer than two years. It's my 'primary' camera, but as I have others [D550, two modest m4/3 and a couple of compacts] it hasn't had incredibly heavy usage.

I took it on a job for work just before I went on holiday and it wouldn't focus or fire (I thankfully was never intending taking it away with me preferring to travel a bit lighter). In fact although I'm able to change settings and the top plate displays these, nothing display wise shows up in the viewfinder.

We have a new 5DII at work and I've tested my battery and memory cards in this and vice-versa. Today I've swapped the CR1616 back-up battery to eliminate that as a problem, but no joy. I can't get a shutter count out of it using the D40 utility either - it just returns the ERR message.

The camera's never been dropped, soaked or kept in very extreme temperatures. In fact the D550's a bit older and been out on just about every occasion with it and stored in the same bag - and is still working fine.

There's no current insurance/extended warranty on it but I am wondering if it would be considered of 'merchantable quality' under Trading Standards legislation. Something of this price and quality should surely be reasonably expected to give a good few years' service without heavy or misuse?

Any suggestions/advice?

Last Modified By ChrisV at 24 Oct 2012 - 5:08 PM
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KevSB
KevSB  101387 forum posts United Kingdom5 Constructive Critique Points
24 Oct 2012 - 5:14 PM

Covered here a few days ago Chriss

http://www.ephotozine.com/forums/topic/warranty-99863

The legal position is no as the Sale of good act is deemed as the overiding requirement in the uk for retailers, But That has not stopped some being successful in persuing it so its always worth a punt, In my case Cannon outright refused at 13 months.

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Graysta
Graysta  91118 forum posts England
24 Oct 2012 - 9:16 PM

In The motor trade it's what would be a policy claim.
If the claim is realistic then it's good policy to pay or part pay repair.
Good publicity V's Bad publicity (policy)

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tpfkapm
tpfkapm  3128 forum posts United Kingdom
24 Oct 2012 - 9:28 PM

this is the part of the sale of goods act that is relevant as long as you have taken care of the item and argue clearly and politely why the item has not met reasonable expectations for a pro bit of kit

14 Implied terms about quality or fitness.

(1)Except as provided by this section and section 15 below and subject to any other enactment, there is no implied [F11term] about the quality or fitness for any particular purpose of goods supplied under a contract of sale.

[F12(2)Where the seller sells goods in the course of a business, there is an implied term that the goods supplied under the contract are of satisfactory quality.

(2A)For the purposes of this Act, goods are of satisfactory quality if they meet the standard that a reasonable person would regard as satisfactory, taking account of any description of the goods, the price (if relevant) and all the other relevant circumstances.

(2B)For the purposes of this Act, the quality of goods includes their state and condition and the following (among others) are in appropriate cases aspects of the quality of goodsó

(a)fitness for all the purposes for which goods of the kind in question are commonly supplied,

(b)appearance and finish,

(c)freedom from minor defects,

(d)safety, and

(e)durability.

when i successfully argued my case for my 40d, i quoted the advertising blurb and promo info which stressed

reliability
over 100000 shutter actuations


the fact that it broke down in good condition meant that their advertising was a bit adrift of my reality

it took 4 weeks but i got the market value for the camera at premium 2yr old price ( £450) at the time

so bought a 50 d

good luck

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tpfkapm
tpfkapm  3128 forum posts United Kingdom
24 Oct 2012 - 9:29 PM

ps, the camera would be expected to last 6 years minimum

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ianrobinson
ianrobinson e2 Member 41106 forum postsianrobinson vcard United Kingdom8 Constructive Critique Points
24 Oct 2012 - 9:53 PM

I am a retailer and manufacturer and I have been known to replace broken drawer runners 2 years down the line, I would expect them to last a very long time not just 2 years so I do this out of respect for the customer and good will on my part, I just wish more companies followed that ethos

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cambirder
cambirder  107202 forum posts England
24 Oct 2012 - 10:47 PM


Quote: ps, the camera would be expected to last 6 years minimum

Not true, it is very much linked to usage where mechanical objects are concerned so there is no expectation of a minimum life time.

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User_Removed
25 Oct 2012 - 12:25 AM


Quote: wouldn't focus or fire

Have you done any maintenance of your own? What are the contacts like where the lenses fit?

You might have the law on your side however if it's going to take a lot of time and energy to pursue the legal route you will have to balance the cost of time and trouble against the cost of a repair.

If you can at least find out what part needs replacing (and get an estimate) you will be in a stronger position for any claim - it might be that failure is down to a manufacturing fault and not wear and tear.

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strawman
strawman  1021991 forum posts United Kingdom16 Constructive Critique Points
25 Oct 2012 - 12:30 AM

I would try a reasoned chat with the supplier of your camera. It worked for my 40D and I had it repaired out of warranty. I tried the

"Hi it stopped working is there any checks you can do to see if its a software type problem"
then
"its disappointing I have not used it excessively you can see shutter count could you not get Canon to have a look as it is an early failure"

"its a shame those lenses I bought from you have been great its the camera letting things down"

Said politely without throwing said camera/toys around. I left the camera with them, and they called a week later to say they could get a repair if I paid delivery charge the rest would be covered.

Its a grey are this reasonable life item. I guess they could throw it back at you and say 1 year warranty, sorry. I guess you could try demanding a 2 year warranty as your rights, but I think a polite request and long pauses before saying how much and looking worried has a better chance.

Last Modified By strawman at 25 Oct 2012 - 12:39 AM Helpful Post! This post was flagged as helpful
tpfkapm
tpfkapm  3128 forum posts United Kingdom
25 Oct 2012 - 12:33 AM


Quote: ps, the camera would be expected to last 6 years minimum

Not true, it is very much linked to usage where mechanical objects are concerned so there is no expectation of a minimum life time.


Quote: ps, the camera would be expected to last 6 years minimum

Not true, it is very much linked to usage where mechanical objects are concerned so there is no expectation of a minimum life time.

True I am afraid as long as fair use can be shown. If you trash it to death then obviously not. Just quoting the advice I was given by consumer direct

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cambirder
cambirder  107202 forum posts England
25 Oct 2012 - 1:15 AM

Its the showing fair use that is the issue, because as I understand it is the consumer who has to show that, which is not always easy especially as most of us end up with a few dings and scratches on our kit. For something like a TV this sits in the corner of a room all its life it should not prove to difficult but for a camera not so easy and I suspect is more difficult with some retailers than others.

In this case the OP really needs to find out what the problem is first and then take it from there.

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KevSB
KevSB  101387 forum posts United Kingdom5 Constructive Critique Points
25 Oct 2012 - 9:28 AM

The fact You have had it over 2 years makes the European warranty out of date also, Unless your camera is spotless, As cambirder Has pointed out the onus is on you to prove that that the fault lies with bad workmanship and not general use/Misuse. Time has no bearing after 6 months from purchase but is dependent on its use by the owner. A user with 220k activations in 8 months would have a hard job proving manafactrers fault against one with 2k activations in 1 year.

you have one option as far as i can see and that is a detailed report from Authorized and recognized camera Technician stating that the fault is down to manufactures build quality and only that would suffice, altho I would take a punt as its been known.

Last Modified By KevSB at 25 Oct 2012 - 9:30 AM Helpful Post! This post was flagged as helpful
keithh
keithh  1022555 forum posts Wallis and Futuna29 Constructive Critique Points
25 Oct 2012 - 10:13 AM

The Sale of Goods Act 1979 states that goods bought (particularly applied to electrical) should be expected to last a reasonable length of time - in the UK that is 6 years and 5 in Scotland. The manufacturer's warranty is a totally seperate matter.

If you can show that the camera is faulty and that fault is not down to how it was used (or abused) then the seller must either return your money, repair the goods or offer compensation to the value of that repair.

I'm not saying that you're not in for a fight - but the law is on your side.

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ChrisV
ChrisV  7663 forum posts United Kingdom26 Constructive Critique Points
25 Oct 2012 - 2:56 PM

Thanks to everyone who's replied [particularly tpfkapm, but I do appreciate the cautionary notes too]- there's some very useful stuff in there that adds real flesh to the bones of my understanding here.

The body is not in utterly pristine condition, but any signs of wear are very light - I've looked after it. As I said I can't even get the camera to return a shutter count, but I would expect it to be in the tens, not hundreds of thousands.

I bought the camera from a large branch of Currys/PCWorld and they tried to sell me an expensive extended warranty after one year, so I do expect to have a fight on my hands. I will try to have a word with the manager this weekend, but I'll put something in writing as a back-up to present to him if I need to or subsequently to contact the Office for Fair Trading with.

cambirder
cambirder  107202 forum posts England
25 Oct 2012 - 5:37 PM

Before doing that I would get the camera to an authorized Canon repair center to find out what the problem is. Because of the age of the camera the burden of proof is yours so without some evidence they are going to be able to fob you off easily. It may also turn out to be something simple like a loose connector so there may be little cost or time without camera involved.

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