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Depressed Moi?

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Krakman
Krakman  73615 forum posts Scotland
1 Apr 2008 - 8:46 PM

The Royal College of Psychiatrists seem to have got it wrong too, along with everyone else Wink:-


Quote: Do something: Get out of doors for some exercise, even if only for a walk. This will help you to keep physically fit, and you may sleep better. You may not feel able to work, but it is always good to try to keep active. This could be housework, do-it-yourself (even as little as changing a light bulb) or any part of your normal routine. It can help take your mind off painful thoughts which make you more depressed.

Eat well: Try to eat a good, balanced diet, even though you may not feel like eating. Fresh fruit and vegetables are particularly good. Depression can make you lose weight and run short of vitamins, which only makes matters worse.

Last Modified By Krakman at 1 Apr 2008 - 8:51 PM
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1 Apr 2008 - 8:46 PM

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brian1208
brian1208 e2 Member 1110247 forum postsbrian1208 vcard United Kingdom12 Constructive Critique Points
1 Apr 2008 - 8:47 PM


Quote: Clinical depression is not brought on by such events. Its tempting to associate the depression with life events, but the fact is that it is an illness, like any other. the first step to beating it is to realise this and seek help.

Stolzy, you are entitled to your own opinions (and are often correct in what you say )- but this time I fear you are way out of step with the literature (and my own personal experiences).

Suspend your arrogant approach for a moment and carry out a search on "Triggers for depression".

You are right in what you say here:


Quote: The fact is that lots of people have such experiences and most don't get depression

but that does not make the corrollary true - many people do have experiences that cause depression.

I don't know how you come up with this statement:
Quote: The impression that it is caused by a perosnality trait or reaction to an event tends to encourage people to try and cope on their own.

in the context of your other points but its clearly wrong.

One symptom of depression is the belief that no one else will understand your problem nor will anyone be able to help you. Its a consequence of the illness, not a cause.

jakabout
jakabout  101741 forum posts United Kingdom1 Constructive Critique Points
1 Apr 2008 - 8:54 PM

One theory is that depression is caused by any number of stress factors, stress being the operative word. One singular event or many, many small accumulative happenings which cause the hippocampus to "short circuit" (andrenaline is apparently the culprit here)...

So drugs like Prozac (incidently one of the most effective in keeping with this theory) repair the hippocampus, which is like a USB cable between the conscious and unconcious. When your hippocampus shorts, the conduit between these two states is broken and as a result you become depressed, you can't compute what happens in daily life.

Drugs like Prozac or others help to rebuild the circuit, if you like, which gradually enables you to start processing again - and you begin to get back to "normality".

Edit: Depression is not a mental illness, it is a physical illness.

and Edit again Smile There has been considerable research into the effects of folic acid, which is generally part of a vitamin B complex...... that and omega oils. I have to say though that drugs designed specifically for the job at hand work faster.....

Stolzy knows what he's talking about.

Judi

Last Modified By jakabout at 1 Apr 2008 - 8:59 PM
stolzy
stolzy  83753 forum posts7 Constructive Critique Points
1 Apr 2008 - 8:59 PM


Quote: Without re reading all your comments , do you think that medication is the only way forward??/quote]
That is my opinion, having worked in the field for many years. Although my background and experience make me biased, the scientific evidence suggests this is the case.
[quote]The vitamin B link seems to be supported by this BBC report amongst others.

Forgive me for not taking the BBC as a dfinitive source. I've looked, and the only serious studies I can find suggest that vitamin B is ineffective.

Quote: Lots of anti-depression advice seems to be that healthy diet and exercise are key factors in fighting it.

As for any disease. It is not a treatment

Quote: Are these reports and advice poppycock?

In the abscence on any evidence, yes.

gcarth
gcarth e2 Member 102289 forum postsgcarth vcard United Kingdom1 Constructive Critique Points
1 Apr 2008 - 8:59 PM

To Robin F
I do hope you are still following this thread, Robin because you might be amused by the rich tapestry of life that is exhibited here. There is nothing like a good laugh, the making of waves or a release of anger or to cure depression.
I think when we are depressed, the first thing we loose is our sense of humour and if you can find a bit of that, then you're halfway there!

Hang on in there!
Garth

Krakman
Krakman  73615 forum posts Scotland
1 Apr 2008 - 9:01 PM


Quote: Forgive me for not taking the BBC as a dfinitive source. I've looked, and the only serious studies I can find suggest that vitamin B is ineffective.


And the Royal College of Psychiatrists are talking poppycock and are not a reliable source?

I'm sorry, but I really don't think you should be handing out this kind of advice.

stolzy
stolzy  83753 forum posts7 Constructive Critique Points
1 Apr 2008 - 9:01 PM

Garth,
I don't have a prolem, but if I read what amounts to dangerous nonsense about a serious medical condition.I'll call it as I see it.

jakabout
jakabout  101741 forum posts United Kingdom1 Constructive Critique Points
1 Apr 2008 - 9:04 PM

I agree, John. Depression is not about "feeling bad". It's an illness which needs proper treatment.

Last Modified By jakabout at 1 Apr 2008 - 9:04 PM
brian1208
brian1208 e2 Member 1110247 forum postsbrian1208 vcard United Kingdom12 Constructive Critique Points
1 Apr 2008 - 9:05 PM


Quote: Stolzy knows what he's talking about

in general I agree Judi, but he has a habit of ignoring inconvenient information:


Quote: There is a lot of talk of depression 'brought on by' bereavment or divorce of childhood experience or other factors - Clinical depression is not brought on by such events. Its tempting to associate the depression with life events, but the fact is that it is an illness, like any other. the first step to beating it is to realise this and seek help.

against your


Quote: One theory is that depression is caused by any number of stress factors, stress being the operative word. One singular event or many, many small accumulative happenings which cause the hippocampus to "short circuit

Last Modified By brian1208 at 1 Apr 2008 - 9:08 PM
stolzy
stolzy  83753 forum posts7 Constructive Critique Points
1 Apr 2008 - 9:08 PM


Quote:
Suspend your arrogant approach for a moment and carry out a search on "Triggers for depression".

Done that, nothing found on NLM.
I'm not saying life events don't contribute, but clinical depression (major depression) is first and foremost an illness. It is no more *caused* by a divorce or bereavement than is appendicitis
People with difficult life events sometimes get depression, somtimes don't - equally people.
Remember this is one of the few life-threatening psychiatric illnesses - its worthwhile treating it seriously

Quote: I don't know how you come up with this statement:
Quote:
The impression that it is caused by a perosnality trait or reaction to an event tends to encourage people to try and cope on their own.without such life events also get depression

People are more likely to seek medical help if they understand they have an illness

jakabout
jakabout  101741 forum posts United Kingdom1 Constructive Critique Points
1 Apr 2008 - 9:09 PM

What I'm talking about is a physical reaction to a stressor - which could be bereavement, divorce or a childhood experience. It's not caused by the normal and natural emotional process.

stolzy
stolzy  83753 forum posts7 Constructive Critique Points
1 Apr 2008 - 9:10 PM


Quote: And the Royal College of Psychiatrists are talking poppycock and are not a reliable source?

I didn't say that, and if the best you can do is to make stuff up......

stolzy
stolzy  83753 forum posts7 Constructive Critique Points
1 Apr 2008 - 9:12 PM


Quote:
in general I agree Judi, but he has a habit of ignoring inconvenient information:

For example?

gcarth
gcarth e2 Member 102289 forum postsgcarth vcard United Kingdom1 Constructive Critique Points
1 Apr 2008 - 9:14 PM


Quote: Garth,
I don't have a prolem, but if I read what amounts to dangerous nonsense about a serious medical condition.I'll call it as I see it.

You seem to have a problem with your spelling which is normally good. Is that because your ego is rattled? I have heard that Prozac and other drugs are dangerous and actually drive people to kill themselves. Now I don't know for certain if that is true but do I know, and you should know, that such statements have been regularly made in the media by medical experts and should not be ignored.
What you conveniently overlook, Stolzy, is that the Medical Profession themselves can't agree on what is safe and what is not safe; what is efficacious and what is not.

Garth

brian1208
brian1208 e2 Member 1110247 forum postsbrian1208 vcard United Kingdom12 Constructive Critique Points
1 Apr 2008 - 9:17 PM


Quote: Remember this is one of the few life-threatening psychiatric illnesses - its worthwhile treating it seriously


Believe me Stolzy, if you've experienced serious clinical depression you will never forget that!

as for this
Quote: People are more likely to seek medical help if they understand they have an illness

once again - yes, unless they are already trapped in the depressive cycle of hopelessness and helpessness,

I shall never forget all the well meaning people whose approach was - "its only an illness like any other - go see your Doctor" - it just doesn't compute when you are already deep in the mire.

In our present society the work ethic is such that depression is seen as malingering and often the first time someone gets any real help is after their first suicide attempt (assuming they weren't successful)

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