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Editing for the Gallery

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StrayCat
StrayCat e2 Member 1014785 forum postsStrayCat vcard Canada2 Constructive Critique Points
10 Aug 2014 - 8:53 AM

It's still the same for me. I replaced the image I wanted to post with another that shows almost as bad. I left it for you to analyze.

Thanks for your help folks, I really appreciate it.

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10 Aug 2014 - 8:53 AM

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saltireblue
saltireblue Site Moderator 43907 forum postssaltireblue vcard Norway25 Constructive Critique Points
10 Aug 2014 - 9:51 AM

Are you applying your own sharpening and re-sizing before uploading, because if you leave it to the site to automatically do these tasks, then you will see a loss of IQ.
As David said in that other thread here4years linked to:

Quote: When scaling images down, there will be some fuzziness, so we apply an unsharp mask which has settings to mimic that of Photoshop

answersonapostcard
answersonapostcard Site Moderator 1012603 forum postsanswersonapostcard vcard United Kingdom15 Constructive Critique Points
10 Aug 2014 - 11:44 AM

One thing you can do Denny is to click and drag your jpeg into the browser you are using and it will show you how the web will display it.

Paul Morgan
Paul Morgan e2 Member 1315324 forum postsPaul Morgan vcard England6 Constructive Critique Points
10 Aug 2014 - 5:32 PM


Quote: I just did a test, photo of a car and the grille (when in preview) didn't look as sharp as original, I think at that point I'm probably seeing the e1 version resized by the site. Denny you would have to upload your photo and let it get to the gallery for a proper test, be silly to condemn the result from the preview alone.

Sharpness might differ, the colors should be fine though, unless you have done something wrong.

StrayCat
StrayCat e2 Member 1014785 forum postsStrayCat vcard Canada2 Constructive Critique Points
10 Aug 2014 - 6:56 PM

I apply sharpening before uploading, yes. I prepare the image exactly as I would for emailing. I might go back to taking jpegs and editing them in Elements 7. I wouldn't put it past Adobe to screw up the old editing programs in order to try and pressure us into buying CC, I don't trust anybody these days.

saltireblue
saltireblue Site Moderator 43907 forum postssaltireblue vcard Norway25 Constructive Critique Points
10 Aug 2014 - 7:23 PM


Quote: I might go back to taking jpegs and editing them in Elements 7. I wouldn't put it past Adobe to screw up the old editing programs in order to try and pressure us into buying CC,

Thing is, Denny...no-one else seems to be suffering the same problems, and certainly ePz forums isn't overrun with similar complaints, so why do you blame the software?

Last Modified By saltireblue at 11 Aug 2014 - 2:10 PM
Chris_L
Chris_L e2 Member 823 forum postsChris_L vcard United Kingdom
11 Aug 2014 - 12:38 AM

Let's get to the bottom of this. I've seen the image and I can see faults. Now you say "This is not the image I wanted to upload. The other image goes through some kind of horrible transformation between my PC and the site. This one also shows noise and faded colours which are not evident in Lightroom."

What you see in Lightroom is not the file you are uploading to the site.
Lightroom shows you your original file. The file you exported from Lightroom (which Lightroom doesn't show you) is what you are uploading to epz. It's a smaller file at a reduced quality. It seems that the first time you set eyes on this version is when you upload it to epz.

You can preview that exported file before you upload it by opening it using any picture viewer (or even your web-browser as K suggests). Export it again if needbe then go to that folder and look at the file using any system picture viewer.

If you want visual feedback as to what an image that you compress for the web will look like then use Save For Web in Photoshop, there are views that let you compare your original to the compressed version as you apply compression:

web.jpg

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StrayCat
StrayCat e2 Member 1014785 forum postsStrayCat vcard Canada2 Constructive Critique Points
11 Aug 2014 - 7:22 AM

Ok Chris, I did what you said to do. I processed an image using LR 4, exported it, then opened it in Picassa's viewer. I zoomed in 98%, and the detail was still there, although the noise is really noticeable to the left and right of the subject. Imo, the image in the gallery is of a fair bit less quality than when viewed in Picassa's viewer.

JJGEE
JJGEE  96302 forum posts England18 Constructive Critique Points
11 Aug 2014 - 7:29 AM


Quote: Lightroom shows you your original file.

Only if:
1) No import presets have been applied
2) No adjustments have been made in either the Library or Develop modules.
But this is not the case as Denny admits to having edited the file.

Chris_L
Chris_L e2 Member 823 forum postsChris_L vcard United Kingdom
11 Aug 2014 - 1:02 PM


Quote: Denny admits to having edited the file

I think you're missing the point Jeff. Denny is happy with his file as it appears in Lightroom but not the version that appears on epz. That's what we are referring to when we say original - the file that his epz version originates from. Could call it "edited original" if the need arises.

Denny to nail this you are going to have do the following. Choose a complex image (such as the one you uploaded). Export it to a folder with a name like test11aug.jpg

Open that file, not in Picasa, but in your web browser. Shouldn't matter whether you use IE, Firefox, Chrome or Safari but you should be able to drag that file and drop it into the browser window or address bar or load it with file-open and view it.

-grab.jpg

That is how the image should look on epz (when viewed large). If you see faults at this point it's not due to epz, they are there before you upload.

Remember also if your upload is too big (dimension or kb) epz will resize your image. You need to ensure file size and dimensions are within the requirements. Be aware that adding metadata, colour profiles etc can tip the scales. Epz will generate some smaller versions of your image; it's unrealistic to expect those to be the same quality as the one you upload.

Next one you upload, email me the same file (not the original) but the one you upload to epz. If you still have those other exports, email them too. Attach them directly to the email, don't let your email program "prepare them" for emailing.

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JJGEE
JJGEE  96302 forum posts England18 Constructive Critique Points
11 Aug 2014 - 1:43 PM

Perhaps what Denny needs to do is upload the RAW file to epz's Camera RAW Downloads Area

Then those of us with Lightroom can process it and upload the result to this thread and then see if we encounter the same issues.

Last Modified By JJGEE at 11 Aug 2014 - 1:45 PM
Chris_L
Chris_L e2 Member 823 forum postsChris_L vcard United Kingdom
11 Aug 2014 - 2:26 PM

I don't see why not

StrayCat
StrayCat e2 Member 1014785 forum postsStrayCat vcard Canada2 Constructive Critique Points
11 Aug 2014 - 6:58 PM


Quote: it's unrealistic to expect those to be the same quality as the one you upload.

To the contrary Chris; it's unrealistic for Epz to provide guidelines for preparing and uploading images to the gallery, and not provide the same quality as the prepared image on my PC.

Anyway, that's beside the point, everybody else is happy with their uploads, so I must be doing something wrong. It's interesting to note that until I used LR, I uploaded for 9.5 years and never had a problem. Using LR, I've had times when I couldn't upload at all, and I've never been satisfied with the resulting uploads I've managed, they are no where near the quality of the 1000 pixel long side final product that I have prepared in LR. I have emailed a couple of images that have been bad on Epz to my second email address, and there's no difference whatsoever.

I appreciate the time you're taking, and I'll try what you suggest above a bit later when I have time. I think that would draw many more members to join E2.

I have another suggestion for the gallery, larger file sizes for E2 members, much larger than they are now. I'm not saying it will fix my problem, but we're right on the edge with what we're permitted now.

Last Modified By StrayCat at 11 Aug 2014 - 6:59 PM
davidburleson
davidburleson ePHOTOzine Staff 72347 forum postsdavidburleson vcard United Kingdom
11 Aug 2014 - 7:15 PM

I'm sorry to hear that you are having quality issues. We have been tweaking some of the resizing settings to correct the blur that occurs with downsizing photos as it was becoming noticeable that we were over-sharpening photos. If you could email the original file to myself david [at] ephotozine [.] com, i'll have a look. It would be beneficial if you could also point out the specific areas that you have noticed quality issues in the image.


Quote: To the contrary Chris; it's unrealistic for Epz to provide guidelines for preparing and uploading images to the gallery, and not provide the same quality as the prepared image on my PC.

In this day an age, most people expect sites to do the resizing for them. So they don't have to follow guidelines. Our only guidelines are that it must be a jpeg, ideally 72dpi and in RGB format (not CYMK). It would be unrealistic for us to expect all users to follow guidelines.


Quote: I have another suggestion for the gallery, larger file sizes for E2 members, much larger than they are now. I'm not saying it will fix my problem, but we're right on the edge with what we're permitted now.

Filesize doesn't make a difference either. It doesn't matter if you are uploading something from the 1mb camera phone or your Nikon D810. It would also be unrealistic to restrict file size as cameras are taking photos at increasingly larger and larger sizes.

Last Modified By davidburleson at 11 Aug 2014 - 7:27 PM Helpful Post! This post was flagged as helpful
lobsterboy
lobsterboy Site Moderator 1014135 forum postslobsterboy vcard United Kingdom13 Constructive Critique Points
11 Aug 2014 - 9:01 PM


Quote: In this day an age, most people expect sites to do the resizing for them. So they don't have to follow guidelines. Our only guidelines are that it must be a jpeg, ideally 72dpi and in RGB format (not CYMK). It would be unrealistic for us to expect all users to follow guidelines.

I think what most people want to know Dave is what size do we need to upload pictures so that the site does not resize them at all (and our image stays exactly as we have created it) ?

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