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Full frame trend

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photofrenzy
27 Apr 2012 - 10:32 PM

Been looking at both Nikon & Canons websites , I have counted six full frame cameras available from Nikon & five available from Canon. Which is approx half of both thier product ranges ,for dslr cameras, The other half of course is the aps-c format.

This tells a very different picture compared to five or so years ago. The market was flooded with aps-c format cameras. With canon having the one full frame slr the 1-Ds then the mk2 nikon at that time had zilch.

I wonder if were seeing a more popular trend or should i say Demand towards full frame digital slr,s.
Whats your opinion ??????.

Are we seeing a drop in demand for aps-c format digital slr,s Sad

Last Modified By photofrenzy at 27 Apr 2012 - 10:35 PM
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Overread
Overread  63763 forum posts England18 Constructive Critique Points
27 Apr 2012 - 11:34 PM

I don't think there is a drop in demand for APS-C sensors in the least bit. I bet you the rebels and entry level bodies still out-sell (both in number and profit) the bigger fullframe options on the market.

I think when one is a "Photographer" be it professional or advanced/keen amateur there is a raised demand within that specific circle for improved performance and improved specification of equipment. As such there is a driving demand for cheaper and higher specification bodies of different format sizes; and the manufacturers are moving to provide for this need; even if slowly. Most likely because it still takes time for them to reduce the costs of production of fullframe sensors (they are bigger and thus do cost more in raw resources to produce).

Canon also has the 1.3 crop bodies (APS-H) in their 1D series so don't forget them



In the future its hard to say, but I think we will see a slow move toward higher specification lower priced bodies; as has always been the case. In years to come we might well see the crop sensor being lost or at least being less advantageous against the fullframe; especially with higher MP and improved cropping capacity. Because, lets' face it, the primary advantages of crop sensor are smaller angle of view and faster frames per second.
As improvements continue those advantages will become less and less of a difference and the price for them also less. Heck look at the 7D to the 5DMII the primary only difference was the AF system in the 7D and the crop factor.

Carabosse
Carabosse e2 Member 1139436 forum postsCarabosse vcard England269 Constructive Critique Points
28 Apr 2012 - 1:42 AM

Far from the trend being to larger sensors, it seems to be leaning towards smaller ones, e.g. the mirrorless contingent.

For sales in Japan about 50% of cameras with interchangeable lenses are now mirrorless which, obviously, means less than FF sensors - a lot less in some cases (e.g. Nikon 1-series).

pelo
pelo  5 Australia
28 Apr 2012 - 7:29 AM

Maybe the trend will be full frame for pro's & enthusiast's, & mirrorless for the rest. But then the number of people who just use there phones instead of a camera is increasing. Canon & Nikon will have to bring out mobile phones like Sony, to keep up sale's.

franken
franken e2 Member 123126 forum postsfranken vcard Wales4 Constructive Critique Points
28 Apr 2012 - 8:30 AM

APS-C sensors were never cropped from something else as there was nothing else to crop it from. What is full frame of?

Manufacturers of so-called full frame declined to call the sensor size what it really is as it's a throw back to film days, ie, full frame sensor is the same size as a 35mm film frame.

The only decline I can see in APS-C sensors is for the smaller mirror less type which is really taking off.

Ken

LenShepherd
LenShepherd e2 Member 62477 forum postsLenShepherd vcard United Kingdom
28 Apr 2012 - 9:33 AM

Some trends are little more than a trickle - though as high quality FX becomes more affordable (as in D800) the trickle will increase in volume.
Nikon appear to have been making 10,000 D700's a month - 120,000 a year.
D3s/x at most were another 5,000 a month or 60,000 a year - combined under 200,000.
The D800 is widely reported at 30,000 a month - or 360,000 a year.
Combined with D4 and continuing D700 sales Nikon FX may be around 560,000 in 2012/13 - a big percentage increase.
However Nikon forecast 4,200,000 DSLR sales in 2012/13 - so FX would seem around 12.5% of the total.
If Nikon become the first manufacturer to produce more than 10% of bodies in "full frame format" that is an important landmark - but it is still along way short of even 25% of units being FX.
Edit - Nikon's 2012/13 forecasts are on page 17 of this pdf http://www.nikon.com/about/ir/ir_library/result/pdf/2010/10_all_e.pdf
The projections do not go into much detail other than mentioning 6,000,000 interchangeable lenses and 12,500,000 Coolpix.

Last Modified By LenShepherd at 28 Apr 2012 - 9:38 AM
Carabosse
Carabosse e2 Member 1139436 forum postsCarabosse vcard England269 Constructive Critique Points
28 Apr 2012 - 1:08 PM


Quote: Maybe the trend will be full frame for pro's & enthusiast's, & mirrorless for the rest.

Although even some pros are going mirrorless.


Quote: But then the number of people who just use there phones instead of a camera is increasing.

Absolutely. There are even some enthusiasts on here who use their phone to take photos (shock, horror! Grin)

ckristoff
ckristoff  10938 forum posts Wales
28 Apr 2012 - 7:01 PM

Excuse me friends, but what exactly is full frame trend ; and does it really matter?

My introduction to digital photography was the 450D, which I loved. In my opinion, it gave me prints as good as my Eos 3, which I still own.

Now that I have the 7D, a beautiful toy, that I readily admit, I haven't fully exploited, I don't feel I'm missing anything in my photography, because it ain't ' full frame '. Nor do I take part in the race for shots per second or whatever it is. I intend to own this camera for several years - because my wife says so ! Grin

In my photographic abilty, what is holding me back, is my age, as my brain slows down; and my lack of understanding post processing software.



Frank.

Carabosse
Carabosse e2 Member 1139436 forum postsCarabosse vcard England269 Constructive Critique Points
28 Apr 2012 - 7:52 PM


Quote: what exactly is full frame trend

An alleged, but probably completely incorrect, movement of buyers towards cameras with a 36x24mm sensor.



Quote: does it really matter?

Not in the slightest. Smile

Camairish
Camairish  81276 forum posts Scotland
28 Apr 2012 - 8:06 PM

I think DSLRs on the whole (whether full frame or not) are on the decline as people realise they can get all the quality they need from much smaller sensor cameras/phones.

I've just had some images from a 4/3 sensor camera (micro) printed up to 20 x 15 inches and the results are fantastic. If this is as big as I'd ever need to print then why pay for/carry around a camera and lens the size of a breeze block?

Each to their own - some folks will take phenomenal images with point & shoots, some will have the biggest and most expensive cameras and shoot sh*t......but they'll still be happy with their camera.

I ditched FF for micro 4/3 2 years ago and feel my photography has become much more diverse since - simply because I use the thing a lot more than when I had all the FF stuff.

In a nutshell I'm into the photography, the gear is simply there to help.

Last Modified By Camairish at 28 Apr 2012 - 8:11 PM
ckristoff
ckristoff  10938 forum posts Wales
28 Apr 2012 - 8:08 PM

Hello Carabosse,

my sentiments exactly! Usually when I post a controversial opinion, I tend to get slagged off.

Do I care? Why no, boyo - I'm from Wales!!! Once you cross that Severn Bridge, you can leave ALL that troubled water behind!!!Grin



Frank.Smile

Carabosse
Carabosse e2 Member 1139436 forum postsCarabosse vcard England269 Constructive Critique Points
28 Apr 2012 - 8:12 PM


Quote: I ditched FF for micro 4/3 2 years ago and feel my photography has become much more diverse since - simply because I use the thing a lot more than when I had all the FF stuff.

In a nutshell I'm into the photography and the gear is only there to help.

Seconded........... in every respect. Smile

StrayCat
StrayCat e2 Member 1014796 forum postsStrayCat vcard Canada2 Constructive Critique Points
28 Apr 2012 - 9:44 PM


Quote: In my photographic abilty, what is holding me back, is my age, as my brain slows down; and my lack of understanding post processing software.

When we grow up, we should be able to do all of that Frank.Wink

To me "full frame" is shooting at the native aspect ratio of the camera's sensor. If it has a 4/3 sensor, then full frame is 4:3.

Carabosse
Carabosse e2 Member 1139436 forum postsCarabosse vcard England269 Constructive Critique Points
28 Apr 2012 - 10:37 PM


Quote: "full frame" is shooting at the native aspect ratio of the camera's sensor. If it has a 4/3 sensor, then full frame is 4:3.

Spot on. Every digital camera on the market is full-frame because the full area of the sensor is used to capture the image.

In the olden days of film, there used to be what were called 'half-frame' cameras. But strictly the term was incorrect, even for those devices.

Pat_Stones
28 Apr 2012 - 11:10 PM


Quote: For sales in Japan about 50% of cameras with interchangeable lenses are now mirrorless

Wow that's a lot, where was that info taken from?

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