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Have Apple lost the plot?

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lobsterboy
lobsterboy Site Moderator 1014128 forum postslobsterboy vcard United Kingdom13 Constructive Critique Points
16 Dec 2012 - 5:58 PM


Quote: From the limited play I have had with a Win 8 machine, and trying to use it as a traditional mouse and keyboard OS, it is terrible.

It must have been a pretty limited play....

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16 Dec 2012 - 5:58 PM

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steve_p
steve_p  81096 forum posts England
16 Dec 2012 - 6:10 PM


Quote: From the limited play I have had with a Win 8 machine, and trying to use it as a traditional mouse and keyboard OS, it is terrible.

It must have been a pretty limited play....

I've used my Windows 8 for about 3 hours, on a traditional laptop - don't find it at all terrible !

arhb
arhb e2 Member 72224 forum postsarhb vcard United Kingdom68 Constructive Critique Points
16 Dec 2012 - 7:21 PM

@Chris, I don't do image editing on my iphone/android equivalent, that's why I bought a big screen, which I'd prefer to keep clean Smile

@Leftforum, I have a searate pair of latex gloves labelled 'special needs' for what you're alluding to Smile

lemmy
lemmy  71835 forum posts United Kingdom
16 Dec 2012 - 7:27 PM

I have an iPad, a Win 7 desktop and an Android S3 Samsung.

They all do their job pretty well. Android I prefer for the phone but iO6 is lovely on the iPad. Win7 is versatile and fast on the desktop. Touch is good and effective for the phone and iPad, It wouldn't interest me on the desktop since I use two monitors out of touch distance.

I've tried touch on a laptop and I find it a bit odd. On the iPad, it's only touch, on the desktop no touch....a mixture of the two I find unintuitive.

What a wonderful contribution from sparrowhawk. Always nice to have a true intellectuals with a fine command of English to make incisive comments about topics of which they have deep knowledge.

Nick_w
Nick_w e2 Member 73852 forum postsNick_w vcard England99 Constructive Critique Points
16 Dec 2012 - 7:34 PM

I don't think it so much as losing the plot, but their products are all now mature, the iPod, has had it's day, you have one, why would you need another (I'm talking nano), Itouch same, it's been overtaken by iPhone and other smart phones. iPhone probably still has a bit of life left, but it's past it's peak (I'm still not convinced android is as secure as apple OS) and no I'm not saying the security of the iPhone is perfect. The iPad again still probably has another incarnation left, before Android systems catch up fully (I have same reservations as iPhone re Android).

My own feelings is the next target for Apple will be the TV, but to take it to a full home entertainment system - some have tried but not really mastered it - that is what Apple have done reasonably well (I know they've had a few turkeys too).

The main reason they have lost some of their panache is the death of Jobs. He had his critics but had a bl**dy good track record, Apple (first time around), Next Software, Pixar and finally resurrecting Apple. What he did well was take a commodity item and give it a twist.

User_Removed
16 Dec 2012 - 7:39 PM


Quote: second thing you'll find is accuracy becomes a thing of the past, Especially when trying to locate a single pixel

Nobody is saying that you have to use the touchscreen for everything. You can still use the keyboard, mouse or trackpad. You might only use touchscreen for browsing.

Seems OSX users won't have that choice but Windows users will!

Can't do this on a Macbook but you can on a 600 Sony Smile




lobsterboy
lobsterboy Site Moderator 1014128 forum postslobsterboy vcard United Kingdom13 Constructive Critique Points
16 Dec 2012 - 8:16 PM


Quote: Nobody is saying that you have to use the touchscreen for everything. You can still use the keyboard, mouse or trackpad. You might only use touchscreen for browsing.

Yup you can choose to use it how you want, maybe use the mouse when it is on your lap or touch when it is in tablet mode.
At work it is obvious that when working together on a design then touch would make life so much easier than keep passing the mouse about.

mikehit
mikehit  56329 forum posts United Kingdom9 Constructive Critique Points
16 Dec 2012 - 8:57 PM


Quote: second thing you'll find is accuracy becomes a thing of the past, Especially when trying to locate a single pixel
Nobody is saying that you have to use the touchscreen for everything. You can still use the keyboard, mouse or trackpad. You might only use touchscreen for browsing.



I have never used one but I am imagining the ergonomics.

Mouse - your hand rests on the mouse and stays there, scanning round the desk to click on links with the centre wheel to magnify/reduce screen size.
Touchscreen - reach out, touch. Press the screen. Retract arm. Read. Extend arm, touch. Retract arm. Extend arm.

It would take someting special to convince me it is more convenient and/or egonomically better....and brings to mind the barmaids refrain of 'alternate, alternate'

User_Removed
16 Dec 2012 - 9:26 PM

I dunno how those things like books, newspapers and magazines got off the ground people reaching out their arms to turn the pages, you need a mouse for that kind of thing Grin

paulcookphotography


Quote: I dunno how those things like books, newspapers and magazines got off the ground people reaching out their arms to turn the pages, you need a mouse for that kind of thing Grin

True Chris, but for anything that may require accurate movement or pressure, you are going to find it more difficult with the arms outstretched approach. How many people use their iPad, iPod Touch, iPhone or any other tablet in that way?

Also, as some have said, many of us use dual screen for working, which would cause a couple of issues converting to touchscreen. Even with one screen, having your hand up obscuring your vision would make editing pretty difficult.

Touchscreen has its uses and does work for many things, but isnt quite a serious contender right now. It is the new fad in laptops, but remember its a technology you are paying for, and may be lacking features/power in other areas compared to a non-touch model of the same price

User_Removed
16 Dec 2012 - 10:54 PM


Quote: True Chris, but for anything that may require accurate movement or pressure

As I said in my previous post:
Nobody is saying that you have to use the touchscreen for everything. You can still use the keyboard, mouse or trackpad. You might only use touchscreen for browsing.

mikehit
mikehit  56329 forum posts United Kingdom9 Constructive Critique Points
17 Dec 2012 - 10:00 AM


Quote: I dunno how those things like books, newspapers and magazines got off the ground people reaching out their arms to turn the pages, you need a mouse for that kind of thing Grin

But imagine having your book 30" away and leaning forward every time you have to turn a page.
I totally agree with you in that it is personal choice, but given that very few people will use the touch screen on a desktop, what is the difference between having a different OS for the different environments (laptop/tablet and desktop, like Apple) and a single OS for tow enrironments (like MS) where the touchscreen is not used in one of those environments? The acid test I guess is whether Apple users complain 'I so wish they had the same OS'.
So in this respect, have Apple 'lost the plot' ? I don't think so.

lobsterboy
lobsterboy Site Moderator 1014128 forum postslobsterboy vcard United Kingdom13 Constructive Critique Points
17 Dec 2012 - 10:31 AM


Quote: for the different environments (laptop/tablet and desktop, like Apple)

Isn't the two Apple environment laptop/desktop and tablet/phone ?

Desktops are fast becoming an endangered species, so really won't have much influence either way. But a laptop without touch is going to look pretty old fashioned pretty soon I recon.


Quote: Things like Sony's Vaio Duo are outAppling Apple

Trouble is Chris, they aren't really out appling Apple. It could be be more interesting and more advanced then anything that Apple produce, but my news feeds and twitter didn't explode with the level of hype on its announcement the way they do if Apple release a minor upgrade to something. No one does hype like Apple Wink

mikehit
mikehit  56329 forum posts United Kingdom9 Constructive Critique Points
17 Dec 2012 - 10:40 AM


Quote: No one does hype like Apple

And I think that's where their problems are starting - they have relied on hype, cutting-edge technology and (what can be sold as) quantum jumps in their products. But those products had better deliver the hype and Jobs could sell something mediocre as if it was the second coming. The iPhone 5 left a lot asking 'is that it?' and when it was released much of the discussion was about the Apple philosophy rather than the product itself. You can't do that too may times without causing disillusionment.
The market has also changed. Up to only a couple of years ago, it was 'Apple or PC'. You had two soluioins to your problem both ergonomically and stylistically. Now, with the tablets you have lord knows how many variations on a theme each with their own quirks and benefits so it is much harder to make something stand out from the crowd.

paulcookphotography

The trouble with a lot of the new tablets, however, is that they are Android based. Dont get me wrong, Android is a pretty good OS, but not every device will be able to upgrade to the latest or future versions and you could find yourself with a tablet thats stuck in the 'dark ages' before long. At least with IOS and now Windows (i would imagine) their tablets are future proof to a certain degree.

When it comes to laptops and desktops, however, it is very much an Apple/Windows world. Yes, you have Linux too, but i cannot see Android or any other OS breaking into that market any time soon

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