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Looks like they got it all wrong - spending bundles of money on a shoot, but skimping on the photographer.
Sounds like clients in my trade who have difficulty getting good interpreters because they get it all wrong: spend thousands on hiring a venue and feeding attendees of the event, and then expecting to get professional interpreters almost for free. Which, of course, always leads to a no from me...
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Ade is an extremely competent photographer indeed and his fee value is high, so getting him for free is hardly "skimping".
very kind William
I think "skimping" was more about the money they'd budgeted to pay for it than the fact they'd asked me
When I did a "fun" TF with them a few years ago, it was pretty much just that - 2 asian models who I assumed weren't getting paid (never actually asked.... rookie mistake), hair and make up done by the lass we're on about in this thread.
Later, after the shoot I started getting quizzed on permissions - they wanted copyright and a to be able to bar me from using the shots because the "make up is new and unique" and "they didn't want people copying it" - it was a whole load of "polite" noise... think one of them is a solicitor by the way. Just ignored it all really - said the copyright's mine and that's that. We all benefited. We all used the photos. We all had a good time.
Then 18 months or more later, I get the message which started the thread...
So she's basically written down what she wanted from the last shoot.
It's just a basic misunderstanding of the industry really - I politely said...
Quote: I genuinely don't believe you'll get a professional photographer to agree to those terms if it's for TF - that's the main concern... no one would want to have to seek permission to use their own work for, say, a blog or flyer, unless they'd been paid really well to do so
Like I say, I can see where you're coming from, but a TF is something different really
Just googled TFP agreements - have a quick look and see how they compare
ever the diplomat
the reply was a conciliatory
Quote: We do have photographer's who have agreed to it - if you want a 50/50 deal its only fair we split the shoot costs...
permission wouldn't be withheld unreasonably... I understand if it's not suitable for you...
anyway - thought it an interesting thing to share, amazing how lowly we're perceived in many circles...
Ade, I'm always amazed how many folk within the creative industry believe that digital photography doesn't cost anything to create. After all, there's no film and we have our equipment anyway.
Then consider the massive over-supply of graduates in photography, with about 97% of them unable to find a long-term future within the industry. Many of these newbie hopefuls are competent image-makers who'll work for free in their desperate attempt to get on the ladder to success.
That's why ad and PR agencies can get away with telling snappers that there's little or even no budget for photography. One MPA colleague did such a job for a PR agency for just £75. Later he found out that the agency had put a zero onto this paltry sum before presenting the disbursement to their client.
The bottom line is that PR agencies and unscrupulous clients can impose whatever conditions they like and pay little or nothing because they can be certain that some hungry snapper will jump at the opportunity.
Photographer are like actors in that the stars get paid and treated well but the majority fare badly
I like those jobs who have a set budget, then try to keep adding more and more to the scope of the work - but can't shift the budget.
Still - nice to have a budget
I was with a photography graduate today - he was tending a bar where I was hosting my exhibition opening... he's got some cool ideas he's looking to get commissioned, but no chance of a "job"... are there any "jobs" for photographers? Or do you just have to go out and do it yourself?
I never even considered a job in photography... just wanted to try something on my own for a change.
it's amazing how long it takes to find the right niche, people, contacts etc.
when I did the TF shoot for these guys a few years ago, I was convinced it was going to lead to a great working relationship.... I guess you just have to kiss a lot of frogs before you get your princess.... or something like that
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