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Is 300 DPI the best for printing?

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rvoller
rvoller  333 forum posts United Kingdom
6 Sep 2012 - 10:44 PM

yeah those ICC printer profiles are *****, thats why I'm starting from scratch, new printer, epson inks, epson paper, calibrated monitor, once I get more experienced I can fine tune the papers perhaps. To print accurately and consistently doesn't seem straightforward for a beginner. Though will be worth it in the end, don't see the point of constraining a decent photo to the monitor, especially after the effort of capturing it.. Thanks for your help!

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justin c
justin c  104527 forum posts England36 Constructive Critique Points
6 Sep 2012 - 11:05 PM


Quote: Forget about ***** like ICC profiles and let the Epson software manage the printing.


What a strange comment and completely the opposite to what anyone that's seriously into printing would recommend.

The generic icc profiles for certain printer models can indeed be very good but for the most accurate print to screen match, increased highlight and shadow detail and overall consistent colour accuracy, then a custom icc profile is the way to go. With several companies now offering free custom profiling, it would be daft not to. Letting the printer manage colours is a poor second best for colour printing.
IMHO, if you're investing in a decent printer such as the R3000 then you owe it to yourself to take the necessary steps towards getting the very best from it, i.e custom icc profiles.

Last Modified By justin c at 6 Sep 2012 - 11:11 PM
Quo_Vadis
Quo_Vadis  2 United Kingdom
14 Sep 2012 - 11:43 AM


Quote: Forget about ***** like ICC profiles and let the Epson software manage the printing.



What a strange comment and completely the opposite to what anyone that's seriously into printing would recommend.

The generic icc profiles for certain printer models can indeed be very good but for the most accurate print to screen match, increased highlight and shadow detail and overall consistent colour accuracy, then a custom icc profile is the way to go. With several companies now offering free custom profiling, it would be daft not to. Letting the printer manage colours is a poor second best for colour printing.
IMHO, if you're investing in a decent printer such as the R3000 then you owe it to yourself to take the necessary steps towards getting the very best from it, i.e custom icc profiles.

I would definitely agree with that, and add that if you use the incorrect icc profile, you risk over-inking or under-inking on the print. One of the things a profile does is to ensure that the correct amount of ink is applied to the media at any given density. Only the correct printer/media profile will work, and even then it's important to linearize (update with a Spectrophotometer) regularly to keep colours as neutral as possible. In short, if you use an incorrect profile, you risk wasting ink unnecessarily.

Railcam
Railcam  7477 forum posts Scotland
14 Sep 2012 - 1:10 PM

I must admit that since producing custom ICC profiles using a ColorMunki my prints are now spot on. Why anyone should restrict themselves to generic profiles within the printer software is beyond me.

Still, sometimes one persons idea of perfect is someone else's idea of rubbish. Each to one's own I suppose.

rvoller
rvoller  333 forum posts United Kingdom
14 Sep 2012 - 4:30 PM

Thanks for the feedback, I thought using the paper profiles with Epson installation would simplify the printing process and reduce any errors that would degrade the print. Looks like I will have to use custom printer profiles as I am interested in the most optimum print output. Can anyone suggest where? Do they always come with the professional paper? thanks. I already have some paper from marrutt that I bought with my old printer and in the future I am leaning to restock with Epson papers.

Quo_Vadis
Quo_Vadis  2 United Kingdom
14 Sep 2012 - 6:04 PM


Quote: Thanks for the feedback, I thought using the paper profiles with Epson installation would simplify the printing process and reduce any errors that would degrade the print. Looks like I will have to use custom printer profiles as I am interested in the most optimum print output. Can anyone suggest where? Do they always come with the professional paper? thanks. I already have some paper from marrutt that I bought with my old printer and in the future I am leaning to restock with Epson papers.

A lot of the higher quality paper vendors will supply icc profiles for their papers - often you can download them free from their website.

User_Removed
16 Sep 2012 - 8:55 AM

Printers that print at 720dpi and 1440dpi are talking about droplets of ink per inch, often several dots of primary colours represent one pixel on the paper.

If you were to print at 720ppi you'd soon run out of pixels. Your typical DSLR image would only be a few inches wide and a few inches high.

You can make a right mess of a photo resampling it when you don't need to.

Read up on dpi and ppi on this guy's website

photofrenzy
1 Nov 2012 - 12:34 AM

Fotospeed produce the best third party ink sets on the market , Also if your using fotospeed papers then using thier inksets and thier free custom profiling service for thier papers only will produce better prints than using epson inks with generic profiles and produce better dealied prints.

especialy in the shadows because the fotospeed custom profile once installed controls the flow of ink much better than the generic profile which is guessing how much ink to lay onto the paper. you should give them a try .

I used an epson r2400 printer with fotospeed chrystal dye inkset custom profiled for ilford smooth high gloss media and they turned out to be cibachrome quality.

livelifetakeapic

hi,
wondered if anyone could help, I've have sent some prints to DSCL (on line) to be printed,at 6 x 4 size they are 417dpi and then when I change the size to A4 for my prints they go down to 218dpi which says poor and sometimes lower dpi. I don't understand why, when I sent the lower dpi ones to be printed (didn't realise) they were blurred. I have a canon 600d and shoot in raw. I have talked this through with photography friends and no one seems to understand what I can do different.

any info welcome.

Diane

User_Removed
17 Mar 2013 - 12:15 AM

What are the file sizes in pixels? Width x Height?

A4 is about 8 inches by 11.5 inches. If you want to print at 300 pixels per inch without running out of pixels then your image needs to be (8 x 300) pixels wide by (11.5 x 300 pixels) high which is about 2400 x 3500.

A lot of labs print at 240 ppi, you've nearly got that if they say you have 218 so you should be fine.

Here's a great explanation

It's really easy to work out sizes, if you need a 10 inch wide print at 300 ppi then you you need an image 3000 pixels wide - 10 x 300 = 3000, it doesn't get simpler than that yet it baffles people.

Last Modified By User_Removed at 17 Mar 2013 - 12:17 AM
livelifetakeapic

sorry what I meant was that when I upload my pic this is what it comes up with and I don't know how to change it, I thought it would automatically change the dpi when I want it printing at a larger size rather than reducing the dpi. Don.t know if I explaining myself properly - I'm assuming I take the pics and then whatever size I want them printing they should be okay. LIke I said above the dpi decreases when I say that I want a larger print??? I'm confused but prob something simple I'm not getting.

Thanks for your reply Chris

Carabosse
Carabosse e2 Member 1139461 forum postsCarabosse vcard England269 Constructive Critique Points
17 Mar 2013 - 1:07 AM


Quote: at 6 x 4 size they are 417dpi

I doubt that: they may however be 417ppi. Have a read of this, which explains the difference between dpi and ppi. Only ppi is relevant here.

If they are 417ppi, this is more than adequate. Online printers base their maximum sizes on around 240ppi.

User_Removed
17 Mar 2013 - 11:04 AM

Read the link I posted and also the one that CB posted and you will understand why increasing the size you want printing reduces the dpi number. Your picture only ever has so many pixels (dots if you like) the bigger you print the more your pixels need spacing out per inch.

If your picture is 3000 on longest side and you want to print it at 10 inches long you have enough pixels to print at 300ppi. (If you don't get that re-read my previous post and the go read the links)

If you want to print that at 20 inches you only have enough pixels to print at 150ppi. You'd have to space those 3000 pixels out at 150 per inch otherwise you'd run out of em. In reality the printer will do that but will interpolate the gaps by inventing pixels to fill them based on adjacent pixels which isn't as sharp as using only original pictures captured by the camera.

Cacus
Cacus  9138 forum posts
20 Mar 2013 - 1:22 PM

Has no one mentioned LPI (line per inch)?

Because that's what you print (or more correctly output) using.

The 300dpi (or more correctly ppi) standard came from the old scanning days when you used to apply a quality factor of 2. This was when you were outputting at 150lpi. The printers resolution only comes into effect when you work out how many tones you can actually print. If memory serves correctly you divide your printers res by your output lpi and square it to get the number of tones you can produce at the output resolution (lpi). (for colour that would be per channel).

So a 300 ppi image printed at 150 lpi to a 600dpi printer should produce 16 tones (or shades of each colour) the same image printed at 75 lpi would produce 64 tones per colour.

So the image printed at 150lpi would look sharper but have less smooth tones were as the image printed at 75lpi would be less sharp but have smoother tones.

Notice the original image hasn't change from 300ppi and the printer is also unchanged (600dpi) but the effects of lpi will effect the look of the final output image.

Now in both instances if we increase the photos ppi to say 1200ppi and output it at the same physical size to the same printer at both 150lpi and 75lpi then the prints will look the same. Same sharpness same tones.

Personally I think the paper stock will have more of an effect on IQ than if you start at 150ppi or 300ppi.

MrDennis
MrDennis  5229 forum posts Wales
20 Mar 2013 - 11:20 PM

My, My, My--So much confusion over Printing these days. Same wherever one gos. Internet, Camera club, House, etc. All Get Confused.
google is your Very Best Friend, I would use it if I was most of you, in order to get your ppi-dpi-sizes-icc profiles into perspective. Oh Yea! also your Calibration, but some people get away with out doing that. Amazes me does that.lol

I use photoshop and ALL my RAW are at 240 ppi. Then I change to 16bit Tiff still at 240 ppi. My Jpgs are saved at 300ppi because that is what Outside printers and Competitions want (give or take a few others). I use a r3000 with fotospeed inks. I can NOT see a difference between 240ppi, 300ppi or 360ppi on Printed Photo Paper at either 1400x1400dpi or 2800x1400 or 2800x2800dpi, except the higher you go past 1400 the more ink you waste. (that is a FACT).

Be carefull with Baryta Paper as it very easily marks and it's then only fit for Bin and that wastes a pricy paper.

If you want to get serious with your prints, then buy a Spyder Calibrater. No If's or But's, buy one.
I'll stop here.Smile

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