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Just Jas
Just Jas  1225716 forum posts England1 Constructive Critique Points
22 Feb 2009 - 8:56 PM

The Customer is King!

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22 Feb 2009 - 8:56 PM

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Duncan_Allan
22 Feb 2009 - 9:06 PM

It never ceases to amaze me at what level the public will accept poor quality and low grade work. Their expectations and appreciation are vastly different to ours.

Giving the customer what they want is one thing but so to is maintaining your reputation and professional credibility.

Offering various levels of service tends to give the customer a price point that is acceptable whilst keeping your own integrity.

User_Removed
22 Feb 2009 - 9:17 PM

Hi Duncan


Quote: It never ceases to amaze me at what level the public will accept poor quality and low grade work. Their expectations and appreciation are vastly different to ours.


I do take issue with what you call poor quality and low grade work. You will find very very few professional photographers who produce work of this nature. I feel you are falling into the trap of comparing a customers needs/brief with aesthetic or technical considerations that a photographer might make when looking at an image and assuming they must be the same.

A professional photographer may well take images that have absolutely no aesthetic merit whatsoever but if they tell the story the client wants to tell than that is all that matters. The vast majority of press photographs fall into that category as does most product photography (as distinct from advertising photography). The vast majority of wedding photographs are not artistic but simply tell a story about a happy occasion in a persons life. They are not looking for photos that win awards but for great photos of their family looking happy. They need to be sharp and well exposed but they are not interested in differential focusing or abstruse technical details Smile

Quite frankly, that is one of the issues that stops many talented amateurs from becoming professional photographers - the ability to understand a clients needs and deliver that in the photography and to differentiate between "photographs for appraisal by photographers" and photography as a product.

Smile

Last Modified By User_Removed at 22 Feb 2009 - 9:18 PM
Just Jas
Just Jas  1225716 forum posts England1 Constructive Critique Points
22 Feb 2009 - 9:21 PM


Quote: ..and to differentiate between "photographs for appraisal by photographers" and photography as a product.

A point I've made many times.
jas

SuziBlue
SuziBlue  1116195 forum posts Scotland10 Constructive Critique Points
22 Feb 2009 - 9:27 PM

However, if you have clients who don't want the standard product and want what a specific photographer offers, then both of them are happy. Smile

steve_kershaw
22 Feb 2009 - 9:34 PM


Quote: Quite frankly, that is one of the issues that stops many talented amateurs from becoming professional photographers - the ability to understand a clients needs and deliver that in the photography and to differentiate between "photographs for appraisal by photographers" and photography as a product

very true

my neighbour was showing me her daughters wedding photo book, It was stunning, in fact it was better than stunning, but at over 4k for the photographer you would expect it to be, but for every 4k wedding tog there is thousands eking a living on the school run,

on a side note, I wonder how many established togs(not Internet savvy) would get a huge wake up call presenting there work here?

edit to add(is eking even a word lol)

Last Modified By steve_kershaw at 22 Feb 2009 - 9:36 PM
Just Jas
Just Jas  1225716 forum posts England1 Constructive Critique Points
22 Feb 2009 - 9:34 PM


Quote: However, if you have clients who don't want the standard product and want what a specific photographer offers, then both of them are happy

.

True...

Last Modified By Just Jas at 22 Feb 2009 - 9:35 PM
Kris_Dutson
22 Feb 2009 - 9:38 PM


Quote: and to differentiate between "photographs for appraisal by photographers" and photography as a product.

Absolutely.

I've sold few technically excellent, competition winning, mood endowed photographs to the general public.

However, technically good, but pretty pictures sell well.

People want to look at a picture and enjoy it all year round, and generally feel uplifted by it. So dark broody skies tend to be out; Bluebells, sunrises and sunsets are in.

My wife, who has no artistic tendencies whatsoever (and is happy to admit it) chooses what I put on my craft and market stalls 'cos I haven't a clue.

Smile

Last Modified By Kris_Dutson at 22 Feb 2009 - 9:40 PM
aftertherain
22 Feb 2009 - 9:43 PM

I agree with the comments made by Barrie.
So many people don't follow the brief, forget who is actually paying for the work and then get huffy when it's rejected.

Just Jas
Just Jas  1225716 forum posts England1 Constructive Critique Points
22 Feb 2009 - 9:46 PM

The secret is, if it is a secret, is to find and make your own niche in the market.

Duncan_Allan
22 Feb 2009 - 10:00 PM


Quote: Hi Duncan

Quote:It never ceases to amaze me at what level the public will accept poor quality and low grade work. Their expectations and appreciation are vastly different to ours.
I do take issue with what you call poor quality and low grade work. You will find very very few professional photographers who produce work of this nature. I feel you are falling into the trap of comparing a customers needs/brief with aesthetic or technical considerations that a photographer might make when looking at an image and assuming they must be the same.

A professional photographer may well take images that have absolutely no aesthetic merit whatsoever but if they tell the story the client wants to tell than that is all that matters. The vast majority of press photographs fall into that category as does most product photography (as distinct from advertising photography). The vast majority of wedding photographs are not artistic but simply tell a story about a happy occasion in a persons life. They are not looking for photos that win awards but for great photos of their family looking happy. They need to be sharp and well exposed but they are not interested in differential focusing or abstruse technical details

Quite frankly, that is one of the issues that stops many talented amateurs from becoming professional photographers - the ability to understand a clients needs and deliver that in the photography and to differentiate between "photographs for appraisal by photographers" and photography as a product.

Hello Barry,

What I failed to make clear in my original comment was that the level acceptable by the general public when appreciating work not necessarily from pros but from amateurs taking on work beyond their capabilities.

Last Modified By Duncan_Allan at 22 Feb 2009 - 10:03 PM
uggyy
uggyy  82104 forum posts Scotland9 Constructive Critique Points
22 Feb 2009 - 10:02 PM


Quote: hey need to be sharp and well exposed but they are not interested in differential focusing or abstruse technical details

I just had the pleasure of visiting the wedding fair today and to be brutal a lot of the images surprised me by not being sharp in the right places or even near technically perfect... The prices where sharp though Wink and the marketing... All about marketing.

Honestly some of the work was 1st class but that was in the minority if you compared the standards to this site.

One other thing, I'm across from a small copy/frame shop and get to see a lot of local togs work and I'm embarrassed over with some of the work these people have paid good money for.

BUT on the other hand, when you offer the client a selection of images and time and time again they choose the weaker images, what are you to do?

Saying all that, I honestly think this web site does set the bar high for us all and that's not a bad thing. If the customer is happy, that's all that counts in the end.

Last Modified By uggyy at 22 Feb 2009 - 10:04 PM
Just Jas
Just Jas  1225716 forum posts England1 Constructive Critique Points
22 Feb 2009 - 10:10 PM

What the customers like is a good price and getting pics by the due date.

stolzy
stolzy  83753 forum posts7 Constructive Critique Points
22 Feb 2009 - 10:21 PM


Quote: I do take issue with what you call poor quality and low grade work. You will find very very few professional photographers who produce work of this nature.

I don't have a denominator so I can't say what the proportion is, but we're all aware of professional photographers, apparently earning good livings, who post work here of very mediocre quality.
I'm not saying this is typical, but there clearly is a market for mediocre photography.

uggyy
uggyy  82104 forum posts Scotland9 Constructive Critique Points
22 Feb 2009 - 11:10 PM

It would make you really wonder about people sometimes when you see what they will pay good money to frame...

I was in IKEA today and seen someone looking for a frame for a photo, mounted image and I helped them a little. Price tag was about 100 on the back, image was mediocre imo.

I think the difference on here is simple, we choose subjects that we love and have the time to go get the best image before we post.

Pros have not got that luxury, customer or brief comes in and we need to get the shot best as we can.

So far touch wood, customers Ive had have been happy (at least to my face lol) but as I said before seldom do I 2nd guess the photos they will choose from a session...

Tommy

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