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Megapixel "Penis Envy"

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paulcookphotography


Quote: And shall I assume you have never cropped a photo for any reason ever?



Of course i have cropped images. As most of my finished worked ends up in square format, its necessary to crop my digital files. However my response was to the notion that cropping is now the way to get a close up of a subject, thus negating the need for a good macro or zoom lens, and completely throwing out the ideals of good composition in photography. Obviously there will be times when a crop is needed (for whatever reason), but that really should be a back up rather than common practice, surely?

As we have seen in at least two threads now, the increase in megapixels is being used to:

1: Overcome the need for a longer lens/converter or being physically closer to the subject (with regards to wildlife photography), and
2: Do away with the need to shoot in portrait, when you can shoot all images in landscape and crop to portrait later (with regards to wedding photography)

This to me smacks of 'i do it because i can', even though the photographer could achieve similar quality on a smaller megapixel (and cheaper) camera by using the correct lens or putting a little more effort into the shoot/shot. Now, as far as i can work out, the photographers who are going down this route did not have this approach to their photography BEFORE moving to a higher megapixel sensor, so they are therefore changing their photography style (based on their new kit) to make life easier, and not to make improvements (in the way most people aim). As i said, each to their own, but i always prefer to push the limits of my kit (and myself) for my shoots to get the 'buzz'

Last Modified By paulcookphotography at 4 Nov 2012 - 5:43 PM
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4 Nov 2012 - 5:41 PM

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User_Removed
4 Nov 2012 - 6:09 PM

I get what you are saying but I can't agree entirely with your negative view of the practice. Nor can you assume that because some people are using it to avoid good composition (although I doubt that is entirely true even with your wedding tog example I'm sure they are composing the shots but then using the landscape as a form of insurance to capture a wider shot than absolutely necessary because of those unexpected moments that you can't plan for) that every one is doing that. Cropping can't make a bad shot good anymore than sharpening can fix an OOF one, but it is a valid tool to tighten up a shot.

Steppenwolf
5 Nov 2012 - 1:09 PM


Quote: I had just bought a very cheap secondhand old Nikkor 600mm f/4 manual focus AI-S lens on eBay.

I guess your idea of very cheap is different from mine.

I agree about the advantage of big MP cameras for cropping. The 24Mp of my A77 is great for extending a lens's reach. What's more you can dial in either a 1.4X or 2X digital converter (which gives 12Mp or 6Mp respectively) and see the correctly framed picture in the EVF - so it looks exactly like you've put a longer lens on. Of course it's no different from just cropping it later but it allows you to see what you're getting.

Last Modified By Steppenwolf at 5 Nov 2012 - 1:09 PM
User_Removed
8 Nov 2012 - 7:01 PM


Quote: I had just bought a very cheap secondhand old Nikkor 600mm f/4 manual focus AI-S lens on eBay.

I guess your idea of very cheap is different from mine.

.

It is all a matter of scale.

But, given that the current AF-S VR 600mm Nikkor would cost over 6000, then any price under 500 for an AI-S version seems relatively cheap to me.

photofrenzy
13 Nov 2012 - 12:54 AM

Please Explain you say you have downgraded to a Nikon D800 ?? . From what exactly ???

User_Removed
13 Nov 2012 - 10:07 AM


Quote: Please Explain you say you have downgraded to a Nikon D800 ?? . From what exactly ???

From a D3s.

"Downgraded" from a full professional model to a semi-professional/enthusiast model. Because I reckoned that the features on the D800 suited my style of "enthusiastic technophile amateur" photography more than I needed the professional attributes of the D3s (or the D4). And because I was able to buy a D800 for much less than I sold the D3s for.


.

Last Modified By User_Removed at 13 Nov 2012 - 10:09 AM
Cagey75
Cagey75  342 forum posts Ireland
15 Nov 2012 - 9:54 AM

Most of us are not buying the D800 to crop the hell out of the massive files. I hate that even other photographers think that because you're buying into 36mp, you must love heavy cropping. Do you think MF users crop a lot? No ... they buy into the system for the excellent image quality.

I bought a D800E for the same reason, it's 1/10th the price of a Hasselblad, and stands up to the quality output very well. You never have to worry about print size, you can pixel peep as much as you like, the files just ooze quality ... 36mp means more than great crop-ability.

It is all envy ... be happy with your 12-18mp bodies, there's nothing wrong with them, but don't be hating on the 36mp ... It's an outstanding camera on all fronts.

What did you "down grade" from btw? The only thing the D800 is a downgrade from in my eyes is a D4 [for the ISO performance] or MF [for overall studio quality].

JohnParminter
15 Nov 2012 - 11:12 AM


Quote: I have come across many (and I do mean many) photographers who ask "Why do you need 36 Mp?". Usually I simply respond that I don't need them but I like having them.


Quote: Because I reckoned that the features on the D800 suited my style of "enthusiastic technophile amateur" photography

Then perhaps LF, this should be your response to folk who ask you why you need 36MP, you don't need 36MP but it just happens to come in the D800.

Perhaps you shouldn't use the cropping aspect form a 36MP sensor as a reason as you haven't ably demonstrated that ability in the examples you've shown to be honest.

Or perhaps I'm just being envious....

Wink

Last Modified By JohnParminter at 15 Nov 2012 - 11:20 AM
paulcookphotography

I certainly dont think the majority of D800 buyers/users are cropping the hell out of their images, but it is apparent that some photographers are, which i think is absolutely absurd. I can only assume that they have either:

A: More money than sense
B: Are buying into DSLRs for the first time so have no prior knowledge of capabilities and are just buying the latest kit, or
C: Using the extra pixels as some sort of compensation elsewhere (hehe)

I am certainly not envious of those who have cameras with high megapixels. I looked into the D800 before it was released and didnt find the need to upgrade the kit i already use (D3, D700, D300, etc). The cost, minimal additional benefit to my kit, and high file sizes didnt really add up to a sensible and cost effective upgrade (for me). The kit and lenses i have are adequate for what i do, and if there is any addition to my kit on the near future, i would say its far more likely to be an additional lens. It wont be too long before the D800 is overtaken/upgraded to an even higher pixel count, i'm sure, but in a camera that is marketed for the 'enthusiast', is it really needed?

mikehit
mikehit  56539 forum posts United Kingdom10 Constructive Critique Points
15 Nov 2012 - 12:25 PM


Quote: I certainly dont think the majority of D800 buyers/users are cropping the hell out of their images, but it is apparent that some photographers are, which i think is absolutely absurd. I can only assume that they have either:

A: More money than sense
B: Are buying into DSLRs for the first time so have no prior knowledge of capabilities and are just buying the latest kit, or
C: Using the extra pixels as some sort of compensation elsewhere (hehe)

A ridiclous over-generalisation and an condescending to those photographers who have taken a measured decision to outlay the cost of the D800 (especially as it is cheaper than a 800mm f4 lens).
Wldlife photographers have been metioned several times where you cannot always get as close to the animal as you would wish and the option to crop is a very powerful tool. If you look at much of the wildlife films footage, a lot of it is taken with hidef video so they do not have to get as close as they used to so can film the animal undisturbed (I guess they are gear neophytes).

Having looked at your pf, I see why you would not understand that Wink

Carabosse
Carabosse e2 Member 1139497 forum postsCarabosse vcard England269 Constructive Critique Points
15 Nov 2012 - 1:16 PM

I wonder if owners of the Nikon D4 (a mere 16Mp costing 4400) envy owners of the D800 (36Mp costing 1900) ? Wink

paulcookphotography


Quote: I certainly dont think the majority of D800 buyers/users are cropping the hell out of their images, but it is apparent that some photographers are, which i think is absolutely absurd. I can only assume that they have either:

A: More money than sense
B: Are buying into DSLRs for the first time so have no prior knowledge of capabilities and are just buying the latest kit, or
C: Using the extra pixels as some sort of compensation elsewhere (hehe)

A ridiclous over-generalisation and an condescending to those photographers who have taken a measured decision to outlay the cost of the D800 (especially as it is cheaper than a 800mm f4 lens).
Wldlife photographers have been metioned several times where you cannot always get as close to the animal as you would wish and the option to crop is a very powerful tool. If you look at much of the wildlife films footage, a lot of it is taken with hidef video so they do not have to get as close as they used to so can film the animal undisturbed (I guess they are gear neophytes).

Having looked at your pf, I see why you would not understand that Wink

Wow, thanks for that. With over 20 years of photography under my belt, 6 of which professional, and several wildlife photography awards, I do actually have quite an understanding of these things.

Those photographers that I was referring to have openly admitted to buying more megapixels in order to simplify their photography. Whether that is to allow them to crop closer, or to eliminate the need to rotate the camera into portrait, and in done cases do away with changing lenses, they have all spent money specifically to do this. Their photography was not suffering with their earlier camera bodies and one photographer in particular has later stated that the time saved in composing the image in camera is lost when it comes to cropping later in photoshop. That, to me, makes it quite absurd.

But hey, thanks for the insults. You may also look at the post again and realise that referring to "some photographers" is hardly an over generalisation.

Last Modified By paulcookphotography at 15 Nov 2012 - 1:41 PM
paulcookphotography

As I also stated, the D800 is aimed at enthusiasts. Typically those who are serious about their photography and kit, and more likely to seek advancement by adding lenses. So why then make the decision to have a camera that (in some photographers opinions) takes away the need to add lenses to their kit or (where possible) work harder for a shot.

I don't think Nikon really needed to produce a camera of these specs aimed at the enthusiast market

peterjones
peterjones e2 Member 123967 forum postspeterjones vcard United Kingdom1 Constructive Critique Points
15 Nov 2012 - 1:59 PM

I didn't downgrade my D3S to a D800; I have both cameras and use them in different circumstances though in professional circumstances such as a wedding there is IMO enough of an overlap for one to back up to the other in case of equipment failure.

In my view the most important part of photography is the creation of the final image and everything else including the camera is very much a means to an end; if I can get it right in the camera I will however I won't lose any sleep whatsoever over heavy cropping such as is achievable with the D800 everything else being equal.

Peter.

mikehit
mikehit  56539 forum posts United Kingdom10 Constructive Critique Points
16 Nov 2012 - 9:52 AM

I came across this thread which shows some quite remarkable capability of the D800E in shadow recovery:

http://www.luminous-landscape.com/forum/index.php?topic=72403.0

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