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Hello - I was looking for a little advice regarding a photo job for my employer.
I work at a leisure centre part time and they've asked me to take photos of all the instructors. These portraits would be displayed on a purpose built board with their names and job titles.
The board will be supplied by them as will any text. There are 40 instructors - they just want a very basic pic of each one - uniformity is the order of the day!
I'd appreciate a little help with pricing the job - any ideas?
Hmmm.
40 uniform basic pics for employer.
I think from what you have written Jamie, it is a simple job which could be done relatively quickly in a room or area with a blank wall at the leisure centre with a just about any camera and flash.
The way you have described it, I get the feeling that you might get your film / processing costs paid for and maybe a drink or two out of it. I wouldn't be surprised if they say use the time you are at the centre to do the pictures and therefore saving money further by not having to pay for your time.
I could be totally wrong, but after reading other questions like this on the forum this seems to be the way employers work when asking an employee to do a little job / favour for them.
On the other side of the coin though, your name might be remembered by one of the staff when they want a job done in the future. This could then turn into two jobs then three...
Good luck.
Terry
I disagree.
Shoot them up against a wall with an on camera flash and you'll get ugly shadows and unnatural images...if that is what they want then I would stay well clear of it - you will do nothing to enhance your photographic reputation. They'd be as well giving the cleaner a digi-compact and letting them do it.
I have more questions before making any suggestion.
1) Assume you will do this onsite at the leisure centre. Do all 40 staff work at the same time or will you have to do them over a period through the day or over multiple days. Might you combine those on duty with those off (coming in especially).
2) Will you use your own camera equipment ? Do you have enough camera kit to do the job ?
3) Do you have any studio equipment (lighting/backgrounds etc) ?
4) Can you do this in your own time rather than whilst you were "at work" ?
5) Will you be providing the prints ? Are you giving them a choice from multiples or just picking the 40 you think should be printed. Do you need to print proofs ?
6) Have you done anything like this before ?
7) Have you got any insurance to cover you while you work on this ?
Mike
Point 7 of Mike's is important!
Your employer may say "we are covered for thrird party liability", but it is not their decision to pay out! If you were not insured and someone tripped over you or your gear then the companies insurance co may not pay out but suggest that you are responsible so therefore the claim is against you!
Yes they are work colleagues but more and more we are becoming like America and people will sue/claim for anything now, especially if it does not cost them anything!
Have you suffered an accident in the workplace in the last three years?
If so then you could....
etc etc
Thanks Mike and Terry for the swift replies. Some valid points!
1) Mike - unfortunately, the instructors only come in 'as and when', so this project could run over 2 or 3 months. The pics will all be shot on the site - I'm thinking daylight only, against a brick wall.
2) I'll be using my own kit - to be honest I was thinking of using my toy camera - the Fuji 6900 purely for the sake of ease. I no longer have access to a neg scanner.
3) Answered above!
4) My boss wants to pay me through my normal wage packet (that is, I would add extra hours to my time-sheet) and the portraits would be shot during the course of my shift - problematic I know, but this is what she wants.
5) I would imagine they'll be happy with my edit, so no need for proofs or reprints with any luck. I will use my local pro-lab to print the images and do all editing and PS work at home.
This is the first time I've taken on a job like this - so far my professional experience is limited to a few portraits and a couple of group shots. I haven't any insurance, but if it all goes tits up, it's the work of a few mins to nip into work and re-shoot the offending images.
I have typed up a proposal in which I make it clear that time spent on this job will be paid at a different rate from my usual hourly pittance!
Thanks again for taking the time to comment.
Jamie.
EDIT - I should mention that they had a board done a few years back. The pics were taken by a staff member with a compact digicam, just as Terry mentioned earlier. The results were awful and the board was consigned to the junk room.
Don't make the mistake of just thinking of insurance professional indemnity being the same as public laibility.
PI is if you make a mess of the images etc..
PL is if someone has an accident because they tripped over your camera bag etc..
Interesting point. I have just finished my photography degree (ducks and runs!!) and will be looking to get professional work, hopefully commission based. I spose I'll have to start looking into all this fairly quickly.
Jamie,
Personally - and you may not want to hear this - I wouldn't do the job in your position.
Why ?
1) They are trying to cheapskate this.
2) You'll struggle to justify the additional hourly rate amongst your naormal hours - especially as you will be doing this piecemeal (see point 1).
3) You'll get grief as to why it isn't done within a day or so. You'' have trouble coordinating yourself and the stragglers and it will drag on. You will be the bad guy. As a client - I would not accept a 2-3 month time lag on a job like this.
4) Ideally you need to use studio lighting if you do this indoors. At the moment you might be able to get some good light outside - but using a 6900 indoors will IMHO not produce professional quality portrait images.
5) By the time you have paid your tax on this you'll earn peanuts. You are also unlikely to get referral work if the staff think you are doing this as part of your normal duties.
6) In the (what seems unlikely event if you are only using a Fuji 6900) that someone injures themself during the shoot (trips over your bag, tripod etc) then you are not covered -
3PL will probably cost you more than you get paid for this.
I'd suggest they get a pro to shoot them if they won't contract you seperately to do this. I'm guessing that if they do the bill will be > 400 (including prints).
If you do chose to go ahead then for whatever fee you want to charge (+ costs) I would make three conditions.
1) You do this in your own hours and are paid separately from your day job. Priced not in hours and minutes but as a piece of commissioned work.
2) You place a responsibility on the centre to arrange all staff to attend no more than 3 sessions within a 2 week period (on-duty or off) to get the job completed within a month - contract to delivery of prints.
3) You select the prints and have final say on the selection. They deem your selection to be sufficient. Otherwise it is cost and time on top to proof/select.
HTH
Mike
To get a Pro Snapper to do the job will be extremley expencive as they'd probably have to visit the leisure centre 15-20 times to photograph all 40 staff. I wouldn't do that for only 400.00 would you?
Can I ask you jimthistle73, how much exactly are your company paying for this beczuse it sound extremely low.
Maybe this may lead to similar work for other companies so you don't want to sart out with the reputation as the 'cheap' photographer.
Get the company to obtain a quote from a Pro Snapper and start your negotiations arount the Pros rate.
I think your employer is just looking for a favour because they know you can use a camera. It reminds me of photos of PE teachers at school stood against a brick wall and put up on a notice board in rows with their names underneath (I think you are thinking along the same lines).
You could use this as a learning experience and just do it as overtime. If you do this as overtime on your current contract then copyright of the images automatically belongs to your employer, you don't have to worry about separate insurance and you don't have to get model releases. Any additional expenses you can claim by filling in an expenses form through work.
Well, I had thought of charging my boss somewhere around the 100 mark, based on these factors:
The shots would be printed at a cost of just 12 by my local pro-lab.
I'm at work and getting paid for doing my normal job anyway.
My boss is happy for the pics to be taken as and when the instructors are available - she is fully aware of the proposed timescale.
I don't intend to spend more than 5 mins on each portrait, including any Photoshop work. (That's 3 hours and 20 mins all told).
I have therefore quoted a flat rate, which would be added to my wages at the completion of the job. I'm quite keen to do the job as it will provide much needed experience (I've learned a lot already without moving from my chair!).
Mike, I've taken on board all your considered comments and added your suggested conditions, except point 2, re the 3 photo sessions. It's just not practical as most of the instructors have other, main jobs.
Thanks to all who have helped with this - it really is hugely appreciated!!
Redsnappa
You need to look at what I wrote. I was suggesting no more than three sessions to do the shots in (ideally 2).
At 15-20 I would have thought most pro's would turn it down. Why waste 15+ sittings that you could average 600+ turnover from each...one one job.
FWIW - I think 100 is too cheap. As a photographer you are not only being paid for your time, but your expense of doing business, your skills and your creativity. As I said I think your employer is taking advantage of you, I genuinely hope it goes well though.
12 for 40 shots = 30p per shot. You must be having 6x4's done on a machine reprint service. Either that or you have a very cheap pro-lab.....
Let us know how it goes - I wuold be very interested to hear if you can do it in under 5 mins each including PS work....estimates are based on experience and so the main thing to do will be to learn from this one.
I wish you well,
Mike.
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