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Torn

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The hardest image I have produced by far, not just technically ...

Sometimes we hide behind our hobbies and not address the real issues - this is my pay back time.

*************************************

Just a couple of thanks I won't name you so don't worry and I have listened to most of your suggestions. (The apple stays as it is Wink )

*************************************

What I will say is I have agonized about every component in the image - all have their reasons


Inspiration from the track "Torn" by Natalie Imbruglia and a Noelle Harrison novel.

Camera:Nikon D700 Check out Nikon Nation!
Lens:Sigma 24-70 f2.8
Recording media:RAW (digital)
Title:Torn
Username:Nick_w Nick_w
Uploaded:2 Jul 2010 - 1:04 PM
Tags:Digitally manipulated, Flash / lighting, Me, Portraits / people
Votes:46
Group Event:Group: Strobist

Comments

sut68
sut68  101994 forum posts England76 Constructive Critique Points
2 Jul 2010 - 1:20 PMConstructive Critique!This comment was flagged as constructive critique! 

A very honest image Nick and one I'm sure that wasn't easy to do from all aspects. My admiration goes out to you for doing it. A well put together piece too.

On a technical issue I just feel that all the main components possibly feel a little 'segmented' and seem to pretty much occupy there own space and personally I'd like to see a little more interaction with each other - overlaying each other slightly, just to make the story seem a little less compartmentalised, unless that was what you set out to achieve.

Love the idea of the handwritten lyrics, just wondering if there was a possibility of say duplicating that layer and setting it to 'screen' [at a reduced opacity] then having it laid over the whole shot [but behind your head], just to add a little more depth to the image? This would also help a little to tie the components together a little too.

Just initial thoughts and not necessarily to everyone else's taste. So please don't let them detract from a cracking image and one that deserves plenty of interest IMO.

Paul

Last Modified By sut68 at 2 Jul 2010 - 1:21 PM

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LesF
LesF  7175 forum posts8 Constructive Critique Points
2 Jul 2010 - 1:46 PM

Echo some of Paulís points Nick, very brave image to upload, admire you immensely, it is a fantastic piece of work by you Nick and as you say difficult on loads of aspects but the true pro you are I bet you have spent hours making sure it was how you wanted it and I think this is a first for you, yes Paul has pointed out things and I do agree on most but I honestly love it, congratulations hope you get the recognition it surely deserves.

LesF

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Nick_w
Nick_w e2 Member 63723 forum postsNick_w vcard England98 Constructive Critique Points
2 Jul 2010 - 1:55 PM

Thanks Paul and Les, to have in depth comments from people of your calibre is quite an honour. The compartmentalization was deliberate - but I love Pauls Idea of using the text in screen mode over the whole image (as well as the original Paul ??). Oh how I wish I'd have thought of that..

On the technical front, yes this is a first for me Les, I've found parts of Photoshop I never knew existed Wink

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sut68
sut68  101994 forum posts England76 Constructive Critique Points
2 Jul 2010 - 1:57 PM

Yes - as well as, so it's still fully legible.

Last Modified By sut68 at 2 Jul 2010 - 1:58 PM

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Nick_w
Nick_w e2 Member 63723 forum postsNick_w vcard England98 Constructive Critique Points
2 Jul 2010 - 2:13 PM

Cheers Paul

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Scaramanga
Scaramanga e2 Member 637 forum postsScaramanga vcard United Kingdom5 Constructive Critique Points
2 Jul 2010 - 2:27 PM

If it's the first time you have done it it's pretty remarkable.

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Nick_w
Nick_w e2 Member 63723 forum postsNick_w vcard England98 Constructive Critique Points
2 Jul 2010 - 2:52 PM

Thanks Andrew,

I have experimented in the past, but I've never completed a project to my satisfaction - well at least to a standard I would be happy to upload. I have always had a liking for surreal art (I have a large Dali print hanging in our living room), so I guess it was only a matter of time.

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Richsr
Richsr e2 Member 790 forum postsRichsr vcard England205 Constructive Critique Points
2 Jul 2010 - 4:12 PM

Like your creativity in this Nick, some good feedback too. Hope to see some more of these creations in the future.
Regards Richard

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Nick_w
Nick_w e2 Member 63723 forum postsNick_w vcard England98 Constructive Critique Points
2 Jul 2010 - 4:29 PM

There will be more Richard, but more as an interlude to my normal work, as its far more time consuming and draining.

I don't mind if anyone wants to say what message(s) they see in the image.

I may do another version for another day based on Paul's observations (and any others that come along). I honestly don't mind feedback.

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TrevBatWCC
TrevBatWCC e2 Member 5TrevBatWCC vcard England6 Constructive Critique Points
2 Jul 2010 - 4:49 PM

A brilliant - if not a bit scary I think - image, Nick. Think it was well worth the effort put in into it. Excellent quality work as always.
TrevB Smile

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andy_AHG
andy_AHG  5106 forum posts United Kingdom6 Constructive Critique Points
2 Jul 2010 - 6:19 PM

Hi Nick - like the treatment that you've given this. The only crit I'd make is that the apple appears to float in the composition and the overall image may be stronger without it. However - I'm sure it's there for a reason. I'd find the listening to Natalie Imbruglia part the most testing! ;^)

Andy

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chase
chase Critique Team 81104 forum postschase vcard England231 Constructive Critique Points
2 Jul 2010 - 6:41 PMConstructive Critique!This comment was flagged as constructive critique! 

Well done Nick for facing the deamons,not easy.
Paul has a good point about the script & that may well solve a couple of your problems in that area.
The apple...if you look closely the silhouette is good & probably an important part of your composition.
The timepiece is nicely placed & contributes well to the feel of this image.
Just a minor niggle is the slight haloing around the top of your head,perhaps the burn tool would fix that in a trice.
I see sadness in your face & relationships that have been forgotten about whilst doing 'other things'.Time is a hard thing to cope with & sometimes there isn't enough of it for us to feel 'complete'.
I like the colour palette you have chosen here,it seems to help convey the message.
Good stuff Nick,again,well done in more ways than one.

Last Modified By chase at 2 Jul 2010 - 6:42 PM

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Eviscera
Eviscera  71093 forum posts United Kingdom149 Constructive Critique Points
2 Jul 2010 - 8:31 PMConstructive Critique!This comment was flagged as constructive critique! 

Top marks for original thinking Nick and so impressed that you are conveying more than scene. An added string to your bow !

"I thought I saw a man brought to life
He was warm
He came around
And he was dignified "

You well know this is a tog site (so any crits will be from that viewpoint) but , from an artistic p.o.v , I think you achieved the perfect vision mate.

Not easy is it !

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Nick_w
Nick_w e2 Member 63723 forum postsNick_w vcard England98 Constructive Critique Points
2 Jul 2010 - 8:58 PM

Thanks everyone, really appreciate all the great comments. No it's not my usual image, tho I slightly disagree Dave all the crits are valid some more than others. As it's an important image for me I will be taking them onboard without changing the meaning.

As for been a photo site, yes it is but I've always believed photography is an art form - the only genre that I don't agree with DM is photo journalism.

I will certainly be delving into this again, I have a couple of more light hearted projects in mind.

Thanks again

Nick

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Eviscera
Eviscera  71093 forum posts United Kingdom149 Constructive Critique Points
2 Jul 2010 - 9:49 PM

Wasn't knocking the crits Nick , they are entirely valid.

I have a view on the mono/colour preference in the arrangement , but thats your licence to arrange. Just meant as encouragement , for your future works in DM and conceptual art.

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Nick_w
Nick_w e2 Member 63723 forum postsNick_w vcard England98 Constructive Critique Points
2 Jul 2010 - 11:30 PM

No problem Dave and I realy appreciate all your help, tho as you say it's not easy and it's very much like marmite.

All that said the point I ventured into this has been lost slightly - the image was my way of conveying what I was thinking / feeling and why.

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Eviscera
Eviscera  71093 forum posts United Kingdom149 Constructive Critique Points
2 Jul 2010 - 11:51 PM

Well , expand on "Torn" Nick , I quoted a few lyrics as a guess.

To leave it open to interpretation is fine , though you will have those who "dont get it" otherwise (been there) Wink

edit , Good start for an artistic debate , rather than techie chat .

Is it the decay and inevitability time brings ? the suffocation of colour ?, the significance of that particular hour ?

Could be a good new thread , and Im off to bed !

Last Modified By Eviscera at 2 Jul 2010 - 11:59 PM

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Nick_w
Nick_w e2 Member 63723 forum postsNick_w vcard England98 Constructive Critique Points
3 Jul 2010 - 9:47 AM

Cheers Pete didn't see that one coming Smile

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LesF
LesF  7175 forum posts8 Constructive Critique Points
3 Jul 2010 - 10:31 AM

Congrats on the badge Nick, very deserved

LesF

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Nick_w
Nick_w e2 Member 63723 forum postsNick_w vcard England98 Constructive Critique Points
3 Jul 2010 - 11:06 AM

Thanks Les.

A bit remiss of me - Dave part way there, I delibrately didn't expand as I was waiting for peoples interpretations. I knew it wouldn't sit easily with people (it doesn't with me) - it wasn't meant to, as I think you know. Between yourself & Janet you probably have about half the message.

Thanks again

Nick

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ade_mcfade
ade_mcfade  1014554 forum posts England216 Constructive Critique Points
3 Jul 2010 - 12:34 PM

Sylvester McCoy's Dr Who?

Wink

really nice PS work here Nick - well done

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chase
chase Critique Team 81104 forum postschase vcard England231 Constructive Critique Points
3 Jul 2010 - 2:04 PM

A deserved extra badge for all that emotion Nick,nice to see...well done !

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Nick_w
Nick_w e2 Member 63723 forum postsNick_w vcard England98 Constructive Critique Points
3 Jul 2010 - 4:21 PM

Really big thanks Ade & Janet.

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Ian-Munro
Ian-Munro  6200 forum posts Wales15 Constructive Critique Points
3 Jul 2010 - 10:04 PM

Nick, this is an area that I would love to experiment in and for me you have nailed this.

I do take on board Paul's critique simply because he knows his stuff. I do however have to tip my hat to an inspiring image.
Ian

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Nick_w
Nick_w e2 Member 63723 forum postsNick_w vcard England98 Constructive Critique Points
3 Jul 2010 - 10:29 PM

Thanks Ian means a lot as I've been a big admirer of some of your latest work.
And yes Pauls comments are extremely helpful, as always after all it's the only way we improve if someone of his standing can help a little.

I would like to say this image is a representation of a part of my life which is now passed. I don't always look this miserable, honest Wink tho it did bring back some feelings I thought had passed. I

Last Modified By Nick_w at 3 Jul 2010 - 10:35 PM

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Buffalo_Tom
Buffalo_Tom e2 Member 72322 forum postsBuffalo_Tom vcard Wales9 Constructive Critique Points
3 Jul 2010 - 11:19 PM

Superbly put together Nick,a fine composition.
Tom.

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Alan_Coles
4 Jul 2010 - 2:09 PM

Great maniplutaion and well presented.

If I am honest with you though I don't understand any of what you have put together and wouldn't profress to understand the message...it is all for you to know and be happy with what you have put achieved I think?

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DaveU
DaveU e2 Member 81339 forum postsDaveU vcard England121 Constructive Critique Points
5 Jul 2010 - 4:52 PMConstructive Critique!This comment was flagged as constructive critique! 

An excellent composite Nick .... it grabs the attention and holds it well. Technically well put together and so much in there to think about. I especially like the subdued colour palette and the silhouette of the girl in the apple.

As for the meaning then that's for you to know and us to interpret it in our own ways. To be honest, the meaning is'nt that important to me (obviously and quite rightly it is to you though) as I'm a shallow soul and just enjoy looking at images such as these.

You would'nt expect to get away without the odd DaveU niggle so here goes. Janet has already pointed out the slight halo around the top of your head, easily fixed though. For me the text occupies too small a space in the top quarter of the image. I'd like to see it more expansive, coming further down the image, maybe the left most margin even being behind the outline of your head. Finally, the torn sections in your face are a little "flat" in that I mean that the dark inner sections are too inky black and lacking in any detail. Maybe worth experimenting with a little shading in there just to try and add the impression of depth.

Niggles apart a quality composite and most enjoyable viewing.

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Nick_w
Nick_w e2 Member 63723 forum postsNick_w vcard England98 Constructive Critique Points
5 Jul 2010 - 8:37 PM

Thanks for a super critique Save

Nick

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DaveU
DaveU e2 Member 81339 forum postsDaveU vcard England121 Constructive Critique Points
5 Jul 2010 - 10:14 PM

Nah, I'm Dave Wink

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Nick_w
Nick_w e2 Member 63723 forum postsNick_w vcard England98 Constructive Critique Points
5 Jul 2010 - 10:26 PM

Oh b*gger I'd never make a proof reader- or typist sorry Dave Wink

cheers

Nick

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backbeat
backbeat e2 Member 8134 forum postsbackbeat vcard United Kingdom1 Constructive Critique Points
6 Jul 2010 - 5:42 PM

Top class imagery...a well desrerved HC

phil

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MickyMc
MickyMc  6 United Kingdom
15 Jul 2010 - 8:38 AM

Great manipulation
Mavis

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Nick_w
Nick_w e2 Member 63723 forum postsNick_w vcard England98 Constructive Critique Points
16 Jul 2010 - 9:26 AM

Thanks Phil & Mavis

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focused-photography

Great work in my eyes.

Carsten

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