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The Riverside revisited

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Last Tuesday's upload in b&w, at Anne Worner's suggestion.
There was criticism last week that the image looked cold and needed warming up. It was taken in the remnants of freezing fog, in a valley where at this time of year the sun rises above the hills around lunch time and goes back down an hour later. I'm hoping that b&w looks even colder!
As mentioned previously, this is about how locals use and enjoy our Riverside Park.
Thanks for looking,
Moira

Brand:Nikon CORPORATION
Camera:Nikon D90 Check out Nikon Nation!
Lens:16.0-85.0 mm f/3.5-5.6
Recording media:RAW (digital)
Date Taken:4 Nov 2012 - 12:00 PM
Focal Length:32mm
Lens Max Aperture:f/4.4
Aperture:f/4.5
Shutter Speed:1/50sec
Exposure Comp:-1/3
ISO:200
Exposure Mode:Shutter speed priority AE
Metering Mode:Multi-segment
Flash:No Flash
White Balance:As Shot
Title:The Riverside revisited
Username:mrswoolybill mrswoolybill
Uploaded:19 Nov 2012 - 7:40 AM
Tags:Black & white, Landscape / travel, Photo journalism
Votes:68

Comments

nonur
nonur e2 Member 6nonur vcard Turkey8 Constructive Critique Points
19 Nov 2012 - 7:50 AM

Very nicely converted, Moira. I like this one as well. The mist around the couple seems to be eliminated in this mono version.

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WhiteRose1
WhiteRose1 e2 Member 41116 forum postsWhiteRose1 vcard England137 Constructive Critique Points
19 Nov 2012 - 7:56 AM

The light at the end of the tunnel gives a lovely depth to the image. Lots of detail but not feeling the cold though, although I do prefer this version to the previous. Looking back I think the shade was a bit blue.

Dave

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fentiger
fentiger  13915 forum posts England22 Constructive Critique Points
19 Nov 2012 - 8:01 AM

Autumn is all about colour so I much prefer the colour version.

Albert

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mrswoolybill
mrswoolybill Critique Team 8526 forum postsmrswoolybill vcard United Kingdom1091 Constructive Critique Points
19 Nov 2012 - 8:09 AM

Interesting comments. The mist along the valley is usually blueish, we notice it quite often. Is that odd, I wonder? Maybe it's something to do with the clouds of steam (we are assured that that is all it is... ) pumped out by the biggest loo-paper factory in Europe, which is just above this...
Thanks folks, and good morning.
Moira

Last Modified By mrswoolybill at 19 Nov 2012 - 8:13 AM

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franken
franken e2 Member 123263 forum postsfranken vcard Wales4 Constructive Critique Points
19 Nov 2012 - 8:18 AM

Well converted Moira. I think I prefer this version over the colour one.

Ken

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cats_123
cats_123 e2 Member 104247 forum postscats_123 vcard Northern Ireland25 Constructive Critique Points
19 Nov 2012 - 8:23 AM

good balancing of the lighter colours Smile

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MacroMeister
19 Nov 2012 - 8:26 AM

The problem with this time of year is that there are a lot of autumn scene images posted on all forums, and although it might be wrong, we tend to expect an autumn scene to be really warm. Here is an example of one of my favourite shots (not my shot) of autumn autumn shot. I suspect that the reason it's so popular (248 favourites) is as much about the warmth of the colours as it is about the prettiness of the view. Perhaps it's something in our DNA? Winter is coming, and we want to see the warmth in autumn as we don't want to think about the cold to come. At least not until we get those pretty snow scenes for Xmas.

I think your mono version here is better than the colour. It's a good conversion, with a good range of tones. Albert said "Autumn is all about colour" and it is, but we have imaginations, and mono can work just as well.

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mrswoolybill
mrswoolybill Critique Team 8526 forum postsmrswoolybill vcard United Kingdom1091 Constructive Critique Points
19 Nov 2012 - 8:45 AM


Quote: although it might be wrong, we tend to expect an autumn scene to be really warm.

As Oscar Wilde said in a different context, The triumph of hope over experience?

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Hop-A-Long
19 Nov 2012 - 8:58 AM

It has converted well and makes a good mono, although I feel the original conveys the feeling of autumn better.

Andy

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MacroMeister
19 Nov 2012 - 8:59 AM


Quote: although it might be wrong, we tend to expect an autumn scene to be really warm.
As Oscar Wilde said in a different context, The triumph of hope over experience?

Quite so, quite so. Autumn has some attraction as we cling to the hope of the warmth of late summer continuing.

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MacroMeister
19 Nov 2012 - 9:06 AM

Moira

I did an edit of the colour one last week (just on my PC - I didn't load it anywhere). I understand that you wanted to show in that colour version the coldness as well as the warmth. I see you shot it in RAW (good!). What I did in the RAW edit was to go to the colour channels. I left the blue alone, but pushed the saturation levels of the oranges and reds. That made the whole scene much warmer, apart from the blueish areas which seemed to retain their original saturation and hue. Doing a general saturation change will screw up the blues, but doing it through separate colour channels in RAW is much more selective.

You might want to try that?

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Tibetan
Tibetan  2 England
19 Nov 2012 - 9:35 AM

I hate the cold and suffer in the winter heavily, but must admit I like this better than the colour version, I have a place for both versions but I tend to like B&W not that I use it a lot, but I feel you get much better tones and textures that you do not get with colour, like it regards Leon.GrinGrinGrinGrinGrinGrin

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frz67
frz67  5 Italy32 Constructive Critique Points
19 Nov 2012 - 9:40 AM

not sure which one I prefer Moira, they both have good points.
Here I like the richness of the gray tones and, as dave says, the sense of depth given by the light at the end of the walkpath.
As per the blueish tones in the color version, you may act directly on the raw file with the temperature settings. Many times, especially in dark conditions, the AWB doesn't work properly.

enjoy your week

francesco

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danbrann
danbrann e2 Member 10495 forum postsdanbrann vcard 15 Constructive Critique Points
19 Nov 2012 - 10:04 AM

As you are aware Moira I have a very small brain indeed and have little imagination.Hence I don't want to think and work out images so if it's Autum I like rusty brown leaves either in the warmth or the cold however I do like this image although I might like it better if it were colour bur no matter you are still just getting one vote.
Danny

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JohnChambersPhotography

Lovely tones and textures Moira, I much prefer this shot lots of detail with the light at the end of the tunnel putting the icing on the cake so to speak. NOT feeling the cold in the shot, but I am seeing a well taken image.

John

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SlowSong
SlowSong e2 Member 64838 forum postsSlowSong vcard England29 Constructive Critique Points
19 Nov 2012 - 10:25 AM

This immediately drew my attention from the thumbnails this morning. The tones are beautifully punchy. I love the dark tree trunks and the light at the end of the path. The detail's excellent. Much prefer this to colour. It zings.
x

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MacroMeister
19 Nov 2012 - 10:31 AM


Quote:
As per the blueish tones in the color version, you may act directly on the raw file with the temperature settings. Many times, especially in dark conditions, the AWB doesn't work properly.


It's also possible that the camera sees a lot of warm colours and thinks it's too red, so cools the WB - to more blue. WB is the only thing set with RAW, all other photo settings on the camera are ignored (if you switch to mono mode in RAW you get a BW image in the viewfinder, but the RAW is still colour). And cameras can be pretty rubbish at capturing faithfully a scene.

Last Modified By MacroMeister at 19 Nov 2012 - 10:33 AM

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mrswoolybill
mrswoolybill Critique Team 8526 forum postsmrswoolybill vcard United Kingdom1091 Constructive Critique Points
19 Nov 2012 - 10:47 AM

Just got back from the Monday morning litter-pick, in Low Prudhoe, just above this. I had a quick conflab with other pickers, the general consensus was yes, our mist is blueish.

Quote: Perhaps it's something in our DNA? Winter is coming, and we want to see the warmth in autumn as we don't want to think about the cold to come.

True, but this does imply that what you want to see may be some distance from the truth! We had our first snow in October, autumn in the North East is not warm.
I try to convey the truth of what I experience. I work very carefully on RAW files to achieve that. I'm not trying to create pretty pictures, it's about the feel of the moment.
Now I need to thaw my feet out.
Moira

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mrswoolybill
mrswoolybill Critique Team 8526 forum postsmrswoolybill vcard United Kingdom1091 Constructive Critique Points
19 Nov 2012 - 11:26 AM

PS Bill has uploaded some very satisfyingly rich, warm autumn colours this morning, from just along the riverbank here. The interesting thing is that nobody has picked up on the fact that it's his shot that is very heavily manipulated. I take the point that it's what we want to see but take my word, it sure ain't the truth. Wink

Last Modified By mrswoolybill at 19 Nov 2012 - 11:28 AM

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frz67
frz67  5 Italy32 Constructive Critique Points
19 Nov 2012 - 11:38 AM


Quote: I take the point that it's what we want to see but take my word, it sure ain't the truth. Wink

our brain is extremely reluctant to accept something different from what it's normally "seen"....
we have to get along with this, Moira Wink

francesco

Last Modified By frz67 at 19 Nov 2012 - 11:39 AM

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Scottishlandscapes
Scottishlandscapes e2 Member 1068 forum postsScottishlandscapes vcard Scotland35 Constructive Critique Points
19 Nov 2012 - 11:44 AM

It always comes down to what we see ourselves. The monochrome has evened out the tones and the colour has gone which for me gave depth and enjoyment. It would be interesting to see what a thermal image would have made of this scene apart from lighting u the warm couple like a Christmas tree.

I think the colour had a little more in it,, the main tree branch for instance plays a large part in the colour version.

Dougie

I doubt this will help.

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mrswoolybill
mrswoolybill Critique Team 8526 forum postsmrswoolybill vcard United Kingdom1091 Constructive Critique Points
19 Nov 2012 - 11:47 AM


Quote: our brain is extremely reluctant to accept something different from what it's normally "seen"....

This is why I regret the decline of the reality? group, which for a while was very active in exploring such issues.
The brain can be trained to expect different things of course. My artistic training was in watercolour painting. And one of the first things that you learn is the importance of blue in shadows.
We're off to find a replacement keyboard for Himself, back later.
Moira

Last Modified By mrswoolybill at 19 Nov 2012 - 11:51 AM

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Joline
Joline e2 Member 8Joline vcard United States52 Constructive Critique Points
19 Nov 2012 - 12:42 PM

An interesting argument going here.....I feel the same way when I upload snow that is blue. Everyone wants white snow even though it rarely is pure white. I've seen it all shades of blues and pinks.
All that being said, this makes a striking mono. I like both versions for very different reasons. I don't think one is better than the other.

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MacroMeister
19 Nov 2012 - 12:51 PM

With regard to several of the interesting comments on what we really see. I had a cataract problem a few years ago and had to have them out and implants put in. Up to that point I was seeing colours as very washed out and muddy looking. The first thing you notice after the op is the complete change in colour vibrancy in everything. I believe Monet had a similar problem which is why he overdid things with the lush colours. We don't all see things the same. I mentioned eyes, but our individual brains probably see things slightly different as well.

Then of course there's that dreaded problem of uncalibrated monitors...

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AnneWorner
AnneWorner e2 Member 7618 forum postsAnneWorner vcard United States43 Constructive Critique Points
19 Nov 2012 - 1:06 PM

This is beautifully converted Moira - I had a play with your colour version and this is rather similar to the mono I ended up with Smile You were using NIK? For some reason, my eyes rest more on the couple in this one, not needing to venture throughout the frame enjoying all the colourful leaves.

I too miss the Reality Group - was thinking of it the other day, and wondering if maybe we were uploading too many images, maybe one well thought out would have sufficed. I am trying my hand at the Weekly Black and White challenge group - it's the inspiration of being given a task that I've missed. It really does get me thinking, and then I found the amoretree Wink

Anne

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RobboB
RobboB e2 Member 887 forum postsRobboB vcard United Kingdom
19 Nov 2012 - 1:25 PM

I like the mono. Really absorbing with all the structural elements to the fore

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TrevBatWCC
TrevBatWCC e2 Member 6TrevBatWCC vcard England8 Constructive Critique Points
19 Nov 2012 - 1:41 PM

A stunning quality mono, Moira, and toggling between the two, I think it's equally as pleasing Smile
Trev Smile

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AnnChown
AnnChown e2 Member 5192 forum postsAnnChown vcard United Kingdom1 Constructive Critique Points
19 Nov 2012 - 2:29 PM

An interesting debate above here Moira but I'm firmly in the camp that wants colour from autumnal scenes. I love autumn and to me that means seeing and experiencing the joy the colours of the rich ambers, yellows and reds bring at this time of year. I can appreciate your work converting this to mono - but I want more! SmileSmile
Ann

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Daisymaye
Daisymaye e2 Member 6Daisymaye vcard Canada9 Constructive Critique Points
19 Nov 2012 - 2:38 PM

The people seem more important in the b/w. They also seem to be sad. Or maybe it is just me after reading about brilanes dog Taffy having just passed away. Anyway, I do like both very much.......Sandy

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taggart
taggart e2 Member 1042 forum poststaggart vcard United States12 Constructive Critique Points
19 Nov 2012 - 2:42 PM

Has a very cold sense----

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mrswoolybill
mrswoolybill Critique Team 8526 forum postsmrswoolybill vcard United Kingdom1091 Constructive Critique Points
19 Nov 2012 - 2:50 PM

Yes Anne, NIK Siver Efex Pro 2 - best change that I've made in ages, it's the first time that digital has reminded me of the darkroom days. I suspected that you would come up with something similar.
As some longer-serving members will know, the psychology of how we view images is one of my (many) obsessions... Wink
Cheers everyone.
Moira

Last Modified By mrswoolybill at 19 Nov 2012 - 2:51 PM

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mrswoolybill
mrswoolybill Critique Team 8526 forum postsmrswoolybill vcard United Kingdom1091 Constructive Critique Points
19 Nov 2012 - 2:56 PM

PS

Quote: An interesting argument going here.....I feel the same way when I upload snow that is blue. Everyone wants white snow even though it rarely is pure white. I've seen it all shades of blues and pinks.

I spent a day last winter studying how the colours in snow, and particularly deep in crevices, vary through the course of the day. We get some fabulous purple snow as the sun is going down.

Last Modified By mrswoolybill at 19 Nov 2012 - 2:58 PM

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BonaFideNut
19 Nov 2012 - 3:21 PM

In b&w or in color, it looks lovely. It's a classical walk down a wooded path. Cracking shot!

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mikbee
mikbee e2 Member 7mikbee vcard Scotland7 Constructive Critique Points
19 Nov 2012 - 3:21 PM

I don't think I have seen so many ''arguments'' about colour on a mono image before Moira !!
No arguments from me as you know I am such a colourful guy !!
It does have some nice tones for mono though !!
Mick.

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bliba
bliba  9 Austria2 Constructive Critique Points
19 Nov 2012 - 3:59 PM

love the mono version

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gary_d
gary_d  7575 forum posts Wales13 Constructive Critique Points
19 Nov 2012 - 5:23 PM

Its a great mono Moira but I still prefer the colour version. - gary

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Fefe
Fefe e2 Member 3Fefe vcard United Kingdom30 Constructive Critique Points
19 Nov 2012 - 5:28 PM

Blimey, lots of debate....................... I didnt see the colour version so I must take a lookWink
Nice in MonoGrin
Diane

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SUE118
SUE118 e2 Member 6SUE118 vcard United Kingdom1 Constructive Critique Points
19 Nov 2012 - 7:12 PM

I like both versions and the B&W version looks to me that a story is unfolding and I will the imagination to you all. Well done Moira.

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jaktis
jaktis e2 Member 1082 forum postsjaktis vcard Sweden
19 Nov 2012 - 7:37 PM

It sure does not look warmer, but it looks great anyway

Peter

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pluckyfilly
pluckyfilly e2 Member 8317 forum postspluckyfilly vcard United Kingdom33 Constructive Critique Points
19 Nov 2012 - 9:03 PM

Cold early morn shot but a goog one same timi

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annettep38
annettep38 e2 Member 3188 forum postsannettep38 vcard France32 Constructive Critique Points
20 Nov 2012 - 5:07 PM

oooooh!
i am surprised that I like the mono better... there you go, autumn colours in mono can be charming!

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twelvemegs
20 Nov 2012 - 8:04 PM

This works very well for me Moira.
It doesn’t look cold, more sort of comforting and romantic.

David

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Glostopcat
Glostopcat e2 Member 8246 forum postsGlostopcat vcard England2 Constructive Critique Points
22 Nov 2012 - 5:39 PM


Quote: Autumn is all about colour so I much prefer the colour version.

Albert

I must agree with Albert here

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