Join Now
Join ePHOTOzine, the friendliest photography community.
Upload photos, chat with photographers, win prizes and much more for free!
The small building straight ahead is the San Francisco Museum of Modern Art. Amongst the Dalis and Georgia O'Keefes was a canvas with nothing but blue on it. That's it. LOL - I guess I'm not sophisticated enough to understand! The verticals are straight, with angled streets and other things giving the illusion of it being otherwise.
Dozens of people walked through this shot, but fortunately the exposures were too long for them to show up.!
I was looking for a good subject to test out HDR for real and I found this high contrast situation. I never would have attempted this using just one exposure. And grads are useless here. So I used 5 for this one.
I did try to process just one RAW file by creating several tiff files, but there was not was not enough dynamic range.
Some things I learned:
Make sure that the shortest (and darkest)exposure exposes the brightest areas properly. I made 5 compositions this evening and 2 were ruined because there were some areas that were too bright on the shortest exposure.
On the brightest exposure, make sure the darkest areas are properly exposed.
On one of the 5 compositions I made this evening, there was a strong blue cast regardless of how I processed the raw files. So I went into the raw files in C1 and warmed them up and removed blue. Then processed the tiffs in PhotoMatix. It turned out well with natural looking colours.
If you have questions, feel free to ask.
5 exposures ranging from 20-240 seconds at F22. No grads or filters.
| Title: | SF Reflections - HDR |
| Username: | 
PatrickSmith |
| Uploaded: | 29 Jan 2007 - 3:07 PM |
| Camera: | Canon EOS 5D |
| Lens: | Caonon 17-40 @19 |
| Recording media: | RAW ISO 50 |
| Tags: | Architecture, General, Sfmoma hdr |
| Votes: | 148 |
Comments
Now that is how to do HDR Patrick. A scene that you may attempt conventionally, but one that you would probably be dissappointed with afterwards. Whereas this is an absolute stunner that demonstrates the technique beautifully IMHO.
Okay, compositionally there may be a few wonky verticals, but what the heck ...
Paul
Very nice example of HDR being done properly
I'll bear your exposure comments in mind next time I'm having a go as I think they will definately be of benefit to me.
Ian.
Thanks for your comments!
Yes Paul, every one of my raw files would look very idsapointing but yet they averaged out quite well. Just as I saw it with my eyes. The verticals may look a little off but the streets that the buildings are on are not at 90 angles to the camera. So they are receeding. But line up the rows of windows and they are perfect. I was tempted to tilt the shot a bit to eliminate the illusion but decided to keep it as it is.
Patrick
what's impressive about this HDR image Patrick is that the sky looks really natural (something that even the most successful attempts at getting to grips with this new technique have failed to deliver recently).
For once I'm not too keen on your composition - looks a bit too busy but as a demo of what's possible with technology it's made me sit up and take notice.
Mike
Yes Mike. Last night I had a nice sunset and tried to shoot towards the sun and try out some HDR. But it ended in dismal failure! And this is busy, but it is the city after all. I do have one with a more open view and a waterfall that I may show later.
Patrick
OutStanding
Next time can you do it modable and upload the original 5 images?---just for referance!
Maybe Kim, though that may take some time. But on this one, imagine the darkest exposure (20 secs) where only the big circle and the street lights are properly exposed and everything else is nearly black. The brightest exposure (240 secs) has the bottom left and right properly exposed with the entire rest of the shot completely blown out!
Patrick
Nice work Patrick - I'm beginning to understand what HDR does now, having looked at some of the examples on the site. Way beyond me, but fascinating.
Patrick, I really don't know anything about HDR, but to me this picture looks beautiful. It gives a good "feel" for San Francisco.
Lisa
this is a superb shot patrick, i love the reflections that you've captured. great camera work, well done.
marc.
Hey Patrick, im just comimg to terms CS2 dont hit me with HDR lol.
Great shot lots of interest and certainly worth the effort and I'm with you on plain blue canvases??????
Keep up the great work
A really interesting subject Patrick and your explanation was extremely useful!! This is definitely something I need to try out for myself I think!
Debbie
Nice image and perspective, excellent work up. You must have just posted, I am never this early in on one of your shots. Spot on! Click!!!
Greg
well, good info Parick, but i think i will stick with the one exposure for now!!!
Thanks for looking!
Angela, it is not that difficult. It requires more work up front, but less work in PS, C!, PhotoMatix and other software programs.
Yes Mounters, that blue canves thing has me baffled. There was a white one too. People did tend to walk by them without giving much notice though.
Go for it Debbie. But my sunset shots are complete failures so far. The colours get all messed up regardless of what I try. Though creating desaturated tiffs does help. Get the trial version and see what you can do.
Yes Greg, it hasn't been long.
Patrick
As said above, a very good example of what HDR is capable of. I have just started dabblng in this (i have done just one), but can see the advantage of it in certain circumstances (this being one!)
Hope we will get to see some more.
Martin
Works well, although being very picky the building at the back has a slight lean - is that a result of a wide angle lens or is it the San Andreas fault kicking off? I talked to my brother in Danville over the weekend and he commented that he had just noticed all his pictures on his walls were crooked!
Martin
Well, Pat! you are over my head-- but it looks to me like this image should be in the museum as well-- Well done, jennnnn
Hi Patrick,
This is a cracker,love the colours/tones,lighting,reflections and perspective.Those buildings are excellent.Take care.Ann
Sorry about the cw words,thankyou for your kind comments,much appreciated.
I think HDR is a little beyond me at the moment Pat, but this looks gorgeous, masses of shadow detail and a nice range of colours.
Do you get nervous taking shots on a tripod with lots of folk around? i get too self concious so i don't attempt it....lol
It is an interesting technique that sometimes makes people to forget the motive, this looks great and I like the wall to the left.
Peter
Thanks for your comments!
Martinl, I have 2 other ones that came out well. I may post those later or at least have them on the website. Yes, HDR helps in these situations for sure.
Martinw, the building in back is perfectly straight! But the street that it is on is at an angle to the camera, the right side tower is not as tall, and the lights in the columns of windows are turned on in such a way that it enhances the illusion. Line it up for yourself in PS. It is perfectly straight! Still, I wouldn't mind dropping a rock from teh top just to make sure. I have often looked at it and wondered the same thing. there are some buildings that are a few feet from being straight. That building was built in 1920 so who knows!
LOL - Jen, I may contact them, as the shots they have are not very good!
No problem Ann.
It is not difficult Terry. I know what you mean about being self-conscious in cities. I'm used to being alone when shooting so having literally hundreds of people including lots of crazy kids pass right behind me makes me nervous. But you get used to it. I just concentrated on doing the exposures.
Patrick
Technically miles over my head, but i know a good pic when i see one.
Nice work Patrick.
Malc.
This is a great result Patrick, and it actually looks natural! A big plus in my book.
Great image and a splendid explanation.
Which HDR soft ware do you use?
Simon
Excellent shot Patrick. Wonderful perspective.Well up to your usual impecable best.
Ron
Outstanding, Patrick!
What a great piece, and beautifully done HDR.
Dawn
Great work using this technique and as you say something that would almost impossible to pull off well using more traditional methods...
Mark
Patrick, thanks for the explanation of your findings and how you got the image to this state. I think theres a lot to learn about this technique.
this is a good example as its remained looking like a photograph. so many seem to go a bit mad with sharpening or oversaturation.
top photograph in my opinion.
you should do a tutorial on HDR Pat, comparing this image to some of your earlier non-HDR stuff there seems to be a world of difference detail wise...excellent stuff.
Hi Patrick
you got it spot on so much detail you do seem to need the right subject
Top class
Steve
Wow Patrick, this is a fantastic shot and quite a demonstration of HDR. Thanks for the posint here at ePz and especially thanks for the technical details. -=Walter
Thanks for your comments! My work computer crashed so I really can't write much right now. Sometimes in the next month, I'll write something about HDR and put it on my website under 'Methods' along with the rest of it.
Simon I used PhotoMatix Pro to process the RAW files straight into a 32 bit HDR file. Then I tone mapped it in Photomatix as well. I hardly had to do anything to it once I created the 16 bit tiff file. Well, I sharpened it, but that is about all. The trick is getting the original exposures to have the full dynamic range necessary.
Thanks Ian, and I have a lot to learn about it. Some of my results are...well.... REALLY bad!
Yes Terry, I'll put something on the website about HDR. I'm going to reprocess a few shots that have limited dynamic range where I can use a single raw file processed several times to crate several tiffs. It works great on some things. Here, there is too much contrast however.
True Steve, and you still need decent light or it all fals apart in processing!
No problem Walter. I have more that I'll show later.
Patrick
Excellent work Patrick,a strong composition with superb detail & reflections.
Janet
A beautiful photograph; a great result from your meticulous work; thanks for all the information. I love your work.
As for 'a canvas with nothing but blue on it'- I have a few thoughts. I think, having looked at much of your work, that you definitely are 'sophisticated enough to understand'.
What kind of blue? What shape/composition was it? Who was it by? (You mentioned it was between Dali and O'Keeffe). Maybe it also involved a meticulous approach to expressing feelings and ideas, or observations of light, colour and composition, etc., on different levels? Maybe the blue changes with the light? Maybe the colour/surface is affected by its surroundings? How was it painted?
I'm an artist with a particular interest in colour - but an unsophisticated photographer.
T*
Nicely taken shot Patrick. I`ve been messing around a little with photomatrix myself, but cant seem to get to grips with it as yet...Must be doing something wrong. So i look forward to your "tutorial"
Chris
Your description gives some very useful tips on this process Patrick. This shot has certainly brought out details in the shadows. Is it my monitor, or is there a slightly violet tint to the vertical flutes to the right of the shot?
Nigel
Good eye and nice spot!
You truely are the Grand Poobah of this place!
Thomas
Thanks for looking. My PC is still having problems so I won't be around much today!
T, it was just a plain sky blue. Exactly the same across the canvas, no change of light or tint as you walk by. It seems to have been painted wiht a simple brush. I saw no connections to the paintings around it either. And there was a white canvas that slow had no noticeable properties that would make one stand and take notice. But there must be something I missed. At least I hope so!
Chris, experiment with the tone mapping sliders....a lot! I'll put something together after I do more experimentation.
Yes Nigel, there is a tint on the verticals. It is on blueish granite and it shows through. And it is at a different angle than the rest of the roght side.
Thanks Thomas. Not yet!
Patrick
You always give a super intro into your images.This is very different for you but the result is perfect.Well done.
Thank you for the comments on my work.
Tom.
Nicelt constructed Patrick, superb detail as we've come to expect from HDR, but you've managed to retain a degree of contrast which maintains the realism
Malcolm
this is one of my favorites of yours...reminds me of an abstract painting on the right side of the image, and the true SF lights in the backround...I know exactly where this is...when I lived in SF , my favorite place was the museum...great HDR...and a must to view large...wow....nice work Patrick ........
alex
Like this image Patrick. I think when using HDR and tone mapping people need to use it subtly and not overcook the image whereby it becomes overdone,cartoonish, and a caricature. Your image are none of these, very natural looking, nice one.
Well done, Patrick! And I really like the reflections in this too!!
A
Fantastic image with great tonalities and detail. Love the reflections and the lights on the buildings. I have done several HDR's with good results, but was marveled in seeing an HDR with such long exposures. Well, every day we learn something.
Antonio
Very impressively done, the finished result really has a balance of detail and light
Sean
Thanks for your comments!
Yes, Malcolm, tone mapping for contrast seems to bring it back to reality. Otherwise it starts looking really strange!
Alex, I like this area too. And I have some others that I'll be showing on here I think.
Simon (poltavia), I know what you mean. If you saturate it very much or overdo other properties, HDR's can look really bad. I'm still trying to figure it all out.
Thanks Tony, I think with the long exposures you have to play it by feel since you are on the bulb setting. And that is good since you don't have to touch the camera or fiddle with that 'successive exposures' thing. So once I have a good first exposure where the brightest spots are properly exposed but the rest is nearly black, I double the exposure time until I have an image where the darkest spots are just right. Usually the longest exposure ends up being 8-12x longer than the shortest.
You're welcome T. Maybe someday I'll understand the one-colour canvas thing....or maybe not!
Patrick
A very pleasing photo, know absolutely nothing about HDR but I'm sure you done an excellent job Patrick....
Great work Patrick! I know exactly where this spot is having walked around the area on the way to the museum while there for the meeting in SF.
Very helpful description as always. I will be looking for the HDR tutorial on your website sometime soon!
Chris
So this is how it's done......? So different for you, P....had to just stare at it for awhile.
The effects you've created are mesmerizing.....
Tutorial? More like a Seminar....
I think Jouko granted my wish, he has sent us an ice storm.....Due to hit at 3 a.m.....I am laughing because we are finally getting some cold weather, but to extremes....LOL!
Anyways, have a good night.....
Cheers,
Suze
Leaning buildings comment above LOL
Always wanted to go to the USA, and one day i will,but i'm sure i have seen somewhere that San francisco streets are not straight but the buildings are perfectly straight LOL..
Look beyond a slight sway/tilt and look at the image and the exposure.
Well done Patrick, i would say this second attempt rules over the first one and this is more impressive as its exposed well all over the scene ...
Well done mate and keep them coming
Dave
Thanks for your comments!
It's easy to get started Cathy. Try it out. I knew nothing just a few weeks ago.
LOL Suzan. I'm still trying to figure this HDR thing out. Some of them turn out really bad. Especially ones with lots of colour in the sky. Looks like the storm turned north and east. You guys have lucked out nearly all winter!
Dave, the funny thing is that the streets are on a grid regardless of the steep hills. But they place the buildings at angles to the street and the towers have different heights so that can look funny. And a few really do lean. The next one will show the entire building on the left. That one leans in both directions! Tapering towards the top.
Thanks Christine.
Patrick
Hi Patrick. This is quite different from your usual work, but it still has the "Patrick Smith" mark of great exposure, detail and color.
guess with this HDR thingie the chances on seeing people in your photos aren't really increasing, are they ;o)
Thanks for your comments!
Yes Dennis and Pete, it is a bit different. I'll do another one on Monday.
LOL - Koen, there were dozens of of people walking past every 10 seconds or so. I'm not sure about HDR and moving objects. The new version of PhotoMatix will have a 'ghosting tool' (whatever that is) that may help to take images from one frame where movement is frozen. Also, these exposures are too long anyway. Even a single 200 second exposure won't show anybody!
But you can take a single frame (raw if you can get it) and make 'bracketed' copies ranging from too dark to too bright and merge them in PhotoMatix and get lots of extra detail in the final version. For your photos, that is probably the way to go. Though yours look good anyway so I'm not sure if it would help.
Patrick
This is what a HDR shot should look like! It looks so natural with a great range of tones. Very well manipulated.
Ted
Found your commercial forum, had fun watching all the commercials that were posted....Only thing, I get stuck in u-Tube for hours after that....It's addicting!
Hope you have a great weekend,
Suze
This is an interesting scene, I haven't tried the hdr thing yet, I can see its going to be the way to go. This blend here I think is slightlty light as in perhaps a little contrast tweek required, I've viewed it several times in all sorts of light and still think the same. A lot of work behind the shot...well done.
Wonderful cityscape, great atmopsheric shot, an oasis of calm on one huge city!
Tracy
Has to be seen large to really appreciated what this HDR can achieve.
Chris
LOL, Mr. Weatherman.....I lived in Lauderdale in '76.....They let school out the day it snowed....I will remember that day FOREVER!!
Elementary school, of course...LOL!
Just this once, let your radar down and have some fun....Guess who.....
Dont know what you did..mate it all went right over my head..LOL...Great shot will have to look up this HDR Thing..
Don
Thanks for looking! I'll upload another HDR cityscape with a waterfall tomorrow.
I know what you mean Suz, I try to stay away from YouTube! Put my radar down? Never! Elementary school eh? I would have though that you were having your afternoon nap time in preschool....
Yes Kin, you might be right. A little extra contrast helps it a bit.
Try it don, and you won't go back. As long as nothing is moving unless you want soft water. Sunsets with lots of colour are not good either...so far.
Patrick
Hello Patrick
I'm a bit ambivelant in my response to HDR - when they're not truly awful, which a lot of them are, - they are (this one included) perhaps a little too perfect ........ maybe the vinyl/digital CD comparison relates to what I'm getting at.
Don't get me wrong - I'm very interested in the whole procedure and in fact have bought the software...... but am absorbing other's approach before getting into it..... unlike me as normally I love just diving in - perhaps there are other things on my mind at present.
I understand the basics of a wide spread of exposures but in pure functional terms how one copes with the change of speeds to alter exposures, without even vaguely moving the camera, interests me - using long bulb with a remote is obvious.......
But having to handle the camera, if only to move the speed setting, when the exposures are outside bulb settings, seems problematic..perhaps I'm over emphasising the problem ..?
....presumably you simply have to be extravagantly careful - if that's not a contradiction in terms.......
Of course in time they will build in a function that responds to an electronic remote device with which you can change all sorts of setting ....... well ....... remotely .....alternatively a function which allows one to set a variety of exposures on one 'trigger'
Dave
Thanks Tony.
Hi Dave,
Yes, I'm just experimenting with it right now. And it doesn't have the contrast that a more 'regular' shot would have. So that is probably what you are noticing. Easy to fix in PS probably once everything else is done. Yes, I used the bulb setting for this one. As long as the exposures are over 1/2 second, I use the bulb setting. I pre-plan exposure times by finding the correct exposure time for the darkest areas and doubling the exposure time about 4-5 times in succession. But even if you do each manually, as long as the tripod is firm, I have not seen a single pixel out of alignment yet. I think the 5d has a setting that you mention but I haven't tested it out yet.
Try it out!
Patrick
Great image, I love all those conflicting lines and the shapes in the buildings. Nice to see some proper HDR.
Darren.
In the 'old days', i got results like this.
My Exacta RTL 1000, did not transported that well anymore. lol
Great looking picture.
Jan
This fascinates me as a use of HDR. I like your explanation and think it would be a very useful addition to the techniques section on EPZ.
But... I have a slight problem with the buildings (you could say I have an erection problem - but that wouldn't be true). It must be due to your wide lens that the uprights don't up-right.
Trust me to have a moan at what is essentially a bloody good image.
Tony
Thanks for looking!
Hi Tony,
While it does look like the buildings are not upright or are bent, it is a strange sort of illusion having to do with how the buildings are shaped. I noticed it while I was shooting but I shot it anyway! The one on the left actually bulges out and tapers towards the top. While the one in the middle above the bright circle has pillars on the left that are closer to the camera than those on the right, so it appears to bend and lean. But if you check the lights on the buildings with the reflections in the water, it is straight!
Patrick
Now that's a good use for HDR!! And I'd much rather see something like this hanging in a gallery than just a pure blue canvas...
Add a Comment
ePHOTOzine, the web's friendliest photography community.
Upload photos, chat with photographers, win prizes and much more.
Got A Photo You Want To Share?
Login or Join Now
New to ePHOTOzine? Join ePHOTOzine for free!
Twitter
Facebook
Google+
RSS
Join Our Free Newsletter
Current Competitions
Vanguard 'Nature' Competition
1st February 2012 - 29th February 2012
This month we want you to capture 'Nature' in all its beauty! We want to see your very best images featuring land, sea, or sky. It can be of animals, rain, sun (if y...Featured e2 Photo
Featured Directory Listing
February's Photo Month
Check out ePHOTOzine's inspirational photo month calendar! Each day click on a window to unveil new photography tips, treats and techniques.
