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Has the government gone too far?


thewilliam2 3 1.5k United Kingdom
11 Feb 2021 2:34PM
Sir Charles Walker, a senior Conservative MP, has delivered a stinging attack on government proposals to hand down a 10 year jail sentence to people who lie about their travel history.

Should such lies be viewed in the same way as drunken-driving or is the government intent upon removing what remains of our civil liberties? Bear in mind that when "our people" ignore lockdown rules, no action is usually taken.

https://www.aol.co.uk/news/stupid-thing-tory-mp-launches-100950875.html
11 Feb 2021 5:31PM
On the face of it it seems to me to be yet another Tory Minister who has got an enormous axe to grind (who knows what) and is riding rough shod over the statistics and the facts. He talks about the fact that the vaccine is the answer to our problems!!!! Does he never listen to the news or read the latest statistics? Half a million people have so far been vaccinated. There are 68 million people in the UK which means that - excluding children - there are around 50 million still to be vaccinated. The strain of the virus which is being vaccinated against is mutating and no-one knows whether the vaccine will remain to be affective on the mutations. And the new strains are spreading much faster. Different strains appear in different parts of the world but as far as we know they are all contagious. No-one knows what the next few months or years will produce. Civil liberties are the right of everyone and we all agree a set of rules in order that we can all live in an ever decreasing space. Those rules, at the moment, place some restrictions on people moving amongst strangers or in large groups for the safety of everyone. When some people think that the rules don't apply to them they are not only risking other folk suffering, in this particular instance, they are risking the severe illness and even death of others. In this case - as drunk drivers risk killing pedestrians - the law has to act as a measure of the seriousness of ignoring the rules. Simple I think - but then he is a Tory so probably not blessed with common sense.
Jestertheclown 12 8.4k 253 England
11 Feb 2021 6:57PM
They'll never actually give anyone ten years although the threat might frighten a few people.
I rather think that it's an overreaction to the fact that people are no longer prepared to be kept under house arrest and are choosing to take no notice of this miserable lockdown.
As William says, (not sure who "our people" are) there's usually no penalty for ignoring it so people are happy to do so.

Dave_Canon 14 1.9k United Kingdom
11 Feb 2021 7:13PM
I think it is disgraceful that we see and hear of so many people not obeying the lockdown. I feel a prisoner and would love to be out playing tennis and taking photos but I do not and not because of the law etc. but because it is the responsible thing to do. A crackdown would not be needed if more people followed the lockdown.

Dave
11 Feb 2021 10:38PM
No one is under house arrest for gods sake Jester.
There are restrictions but without them I dread to think of the misery it would be causing for many more families.
The government can increase fines as much as they like but unless they address inequality and provide adequate support for people as well as making sure businesses are ‘Covid secure’ they will never work.
Seems to me they are just headline grabbing rather than addressing the real issues.

Carabosse 17 41.5k 270 England
12 Feb 2021 1:32AM
Some scientists say Covid could be with us for 10+ years. A sobering thought.

We'll simply have to learn to live with it. The planet cannot grind to a halt for an extended period.
12 Feb 2021 7:12AM
A virus as prevalent as Covid? Viruses like this need an elimination strategy. Saying it will become endemic and people have to accept this fills me with dread, it’s dangerous.
DaveRyder Plus
6 5.1k 7 United Kingdom
12 Feb 2021 8:59AM

Quote:A virus as prevalent as Covid? Viruses like this need an elimination strategy. Saying it will become endemic and people have to accept this fills me with dread, it’s dangerous.


I'd agree if it was just a UK issue. However it will never be eradicated unless it is done globally and/or travel is severely restricted and controlled.

This, I think will be like AIDS/HIV, a year or two of headlines them fade into the background.
Treatments and vaccines will push this particular disease into the less important issues, death rates associated will drop to fall within the 'normal' daily average of - the UK has on average around 1700 deaths per day (higher winter/lower summer). If it rose by 100 would it be news worthy for very long?

If it doesn't bother our daily lives (in the UK/Developed World) will we know or concern ourselves about it - before you all shut yes think about cholera, dysentery etc and yes AIDS. All global concerns but not something we give more than a minutes thought to and only when that advert to text £3 appears on TV.
DaveRyder Plus
6 5.1k 7 United Kingdom
12 Feb 2021 9:06AM
To OP - No the Government hasn't gone to far yet.

But - once vaccination programs get to say 65-70% of population. Associated death rates drop to this becoming a moderate illness rather and hospitalisation illness with life threatening impacts then we really need to get back to normal daily life and start living again.

If this doesn't happen then the government will have gone to far.

Everyone is currently, and correctly, concerned with COVID. But there are longer term impacts on health, cancers etc, mental health, poverty and other issues related to shutting society down. These may see more premature deaths annually over the next 15-20yrs than covid has this year.

ONS data shows Death rates in April for a few weeks 100% above normal current winter covid peak 50% above normal background levels.

ONS
Big Bri 19 16.7k United Kingdom
12 Feb 2021 9:09AM

Quote:As William says, (not sure who "our people" are) there's usually no penalty for ignoring it so people are happy to do so.


I assume what he means is, millionaire Cummings got away with it (like his family got away with building two houses without planning permission and not paying council tax on them for years), but no way in hell will Joe Public get away with it.
Big Bri 19 16.7k United Kingdom
12 Feb 2021 9:13AM

Quote:Half a million people have so far been vaccinated.


According to the BBC this morning, 13,577,851 doses have been given out.
saltireblue Plus
10 11.6k 71 Norway
12 Feb 2021 9:19AM

Quote:
Quote:Half a million people have so far been vaccinated.


According to the BBC this morning, 13,577,851 doses have been given out.


I think the ½ million refers to the number who have received 2 doses...
Jestertheclown 12 8.4k 253 England
12 Feb 2021 9:20AM

Quote:No one is under house arrest for gods sake Jester.


We're not far from it.
According to these rules/laws/guidelines; it's impossible to decide which is which, I'm allowed to walk the dog (I can't "socialise" with my mates, the other dog owners even in countryside that stretches to the horizon) and go to Sainsburys.
And that's about it.


12 Feb 2021 10:39AM
Not arguing with your figures Malc but I do wonder how accurate they are! 'I was phoned yesterday to ask 'which arm I had the vaccine in?' So obviously in someone's list I had been vaccinated. I haven't - I am going today. This in spite of the fact that I have been asked by the MHRA to give weekly reports on my progress - which I have done.
Jestertheclown 12 8.4k 253 England
12 Feb 2021 11:02AM

Quote:Not arguing with your figures Malc but I do wonder how accurate they are!

No fault of Malc but the figures are probably as accurate as all the other figures that we're being fed . . .

. . . so inaccurate as to be a work of fiction.

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