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Mirror or Mirrorless DSLR?


10 Apr 2019 9:01AM
can any kind sole tell me the pros and cons of mirror or mirrorless cameras please

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Tianshi_angie 4 2.6k England
10 Apr 2019 9:21AM
I think this is a question which is a bit like asking what is the difference between Contact Lenses and Glasses - they both do the same job and different types of both are better or not so good as others and it is very much according to personal preferences. I have just changed from a DSLR to a Mirrorless because I could no longer manage the weight of a DSLR comfortably - the mirrorless is a lot lighter. I cannot directly compare the two and their competency in what they do - take photographs - because the DSLR is now old and the mirrorless is a much newer model which has later technology. So I can only advise to look at some of each and find what you are comfortable with. I was very happy with my DSLR and I am becoming very fond of my mirrorless.
sherlob Plus
13 3.1k 129 United Kingdom
10 Apr 2019 11:26AM
A quick google search shows numerous articles. E.g. this one . I suspect there are a few articles on here too.

A better question may be to ask for an opinion to compare a few models that interest you.

Adam
seahawk 12 1.3k United Kingdom
10 Apr 2019 11:57AM
Having moved from a Nikon D7000 and various lenses to a Panny Lumix G80 outfit I have identified 2 major advantages of the mirrorless Lumix.
1. The kit is much lighter in weight and easier to carry for hours on end.
2. The EVF shows you what the photo will look like and it updates in real time if you change the exposure settings.

Both of these advantages would apply to a full-frame mirrorless camera though the lenses' weight remains in issue with full-frame.
I have not found any drop in quality from the APSC to MFT sensor and I can print the shots from the G80 up to A3+ (not tried to go bigger than that yet).
My son now uses the Nikon - when I pick it up now I wonder how I ever managed to carry it during a 5 hour walk in the Alps! I don't regret the change for a minute.
banehawi Plus
15 2.1k 4036 Canada
10 Apr 2019 4:11PM
Just to compare actual weights, which is a topic that attracts loads of attention.

A Canon 6D full frame camera, including battery, weights 770 grams

A Sony A7ii full frame camera, including battery weights 600 grams

Thats a whole 170 grams difference, which essentially is trivial.

Its lenses that are heavy, and they weight of lenses for either system are comparable in full frame systems.

APS-C systems from Fuji for example, have cameras weighing around the 500 gram range, and the lenses are lighter. Same for Sony.

To get any weight advantage for the camera itself, you need to go small, such as the micro 4/3 system. The lenses are also smaller, and lighter.

One advantage of mirror less is the ability to see, real time, what the image will look like, as you alter exposure settings. Thats very useful.
JackAllTog Plus
10 5.7k 58 United Kingdom
10 Apr 2019 6:44PM
Mirrorless is what is in mobile phones and compact cameras, and some much more expensive ones too.
Typically they use the camera sensor to show you the image view you are about to take.
Mirror cameras redirect the light from the scene you are about to shoot into a viewfinder. You see the image in real time and at the same brightness as the scene. The mirror physically flips out the way when you shoot so that momentarily you can't see the subject.
New mirrorless designs, not needing the space for a mirror, can allow new wider brighter lenses.

What's your budget?
10 Apr 2019 9:24PM
Well there was a time when a DSLR was a “mirrored” type, following on from film SLR types...but now it’s possible to get many camera variants without the “flapping mirror” of the previous SLR models..

This saves a fair amount of weight, (mechanicals etc..).

An electronic viewfinder takes the image directly from the sensor to your eye, (though not too cleverly in early versions of this technology...) and not through a mirror system, which did/does at least give a clear, visual indication of what you can actually “see”..

Nowadays however, a “mirrorless” camera can, with advances in technology, be equally useable, from the smaller sensors in many compact devices, to APS-C (same as most DSLR cameras...e,g. Sony A6000 family) and on to “full-frame” types, which get back to 35mm film SLR image sizes...!

Anyhow...I think the main advantage is physical size/weight, technology, and lens sizes/weights (though this can be less definite..). I use a Nikon D300 (DSLR) but am getting used to a Sony A6000 system, which is much lighter and more compact..
LenShepherd 11 4.0k United Kingdom
11 Apr 2019 8:39AM

Quote:can any kind sole tell me the pros and cons of mirror or mirrorless cameras please

The obvious difference is DSLR's and ML work in different ways to achieve a photo.

In the background there are 3 commonly used formats, being 4:3 (the smallest sensor), around 18x24 (mid size sensor) and 24x36 (the largest commonly used sensor). There are also medium format sensors though relatively few in sales number.

The major advantage of a smaller sensor if you have a number of lenses is a smaller outfit size and less cost as lenses used have a narrower angle of view, meaning less need for long focal length big, heavy and expensive lenses.

The moderate disadvantage of a smaller format is generally less resolution and poorer high ISO noise performance, though still way better than film in the film era.

Mirrorless removes the mirror so saving weight etc, generally has IBIS which works on all lenses, but needs battery power to provide an electronic viewfinder so fewer fewer shots per battery charge, and seeing through a viewfinder which is always on is not an option.

The "advantages" (there also disadvantages) of mirrorless are largely intertwined with format size.

Mirrorless it is the only option with 4:3 format. Mirrorless is about 30% of current sales with 18x24, and about 35% of sales in 24x36 format though 24x36 is moving fast toward mirrorless. There is plenty of choice between DSLR and ML other than with 4:3 format.

In the background ML tends to be relatively expensive, the enthusiasts camera market is shrining at least 33% a year - with increasing amounts of DSLR equipment available at good prices second hand.

Many enthusiast photographers are age 55+ and trade to smaller format ML to save weight, though usually not money, if switching systems.

Mirrorless is "the future", including new larger lens mounts for better optical quality from 3 of the 4 main 24x36 manufacturers. You have to pay for what you are getting, meaning the best image quality is getting distinctly more expensive.

On a budget second hand DSLR's IMO easily gives the best value for money, small format mirrorless is an obvious choice for the relatively infirm, and 24x36 mirrorless is the way forward as new lenses reach the market - for the relatively affluent who can afford the new choices.

There is also medium format mirrorless - for those with serious money available.
Tianshi_angie 4 2.6k England
11 Apr 2019 11:14AM
There are also mirrorless in the secondhand market and Amazon do have special offers from time to time.
LenShepherd 11 4.0k United Kingdom
11 Apr 2019 11:21AM

Quote:There are also mirrorless in the secondhand

Agreed - though as mirrorless is not mature technology many secondhand ML are distinctly inferior to either current ML or second hand DSLR equipment.
themak 6 1.0k Scotland
11 Apr 2019 6:32PM

Quote:Agreed - though as mirrorless is not mature technology many secondhand ML are distinctly inferior to either current ML or second hand DSLR equipment.


Certainly applies to Nikon mirrorless.
bornstupix2 2 90 1 France
11 Apr 2019 7:47PM
It has long been an accepted fact that the closer the rear element is to the film plane or sensor the more difficult it is to achieve high quality images where wider angle lenses are concerned. This is not as obvious with "standard" or telephoto lens settings.This is due, as many of us are aware, to the manipulation of light rays into the front element, thru the interior optics and then out to the four corners of the image frame. The actual images that are available to illustrate these light paths are varied and complex. A square or near square format shows less edge problems than a full frame 35mm or 16 on 120 shape. As many of todays photo processing programs are capable of correction of this problem it is gradually ceasing to be an issue but still exsists in the minds of many reviewers and users of kit today. It does remain that the nearer the rear element of a wide angle lens is to the film/sensor plane the more likely to produce a reduction in quality but this is a small consideration when taking in the huge progress made in mirrorless kit these days. My bug bear is (and always will be) I love my ground glass focus screen to compose with.
LenShepherd 11 4.0k United Kingdom
11 Apr 2019 9:06PM

Quote:It has long been an accepted fact that the closer the rear element is to the film plane or sensor the more difficult it is to achieve high quality images where wider angle lenses are concerned.

My understanding is very different - corner shading maybe but general resolution no.

While the lens flange to sensor distance is fixed by the camera the rear element can be further forward than the lens mount.

Sony E with its short lens mount to sensor distance has introduced a range of wide angle which are generally better than equivalent Canon/Nikon as, with no mirror, wide angle design does not have to be retro focus to allow space for the mirror to lift.

In the medium term Nikon, Canon and Panasonic L mount are promising even higher optical performance with some of their wider lens mount; though just a few months after Nikon/Canon 24x36 launches there are few native mirrorless lenses as yet.

The world does not stand still. Maybe 3 years from now Nikon S/Canon R/ L mount will have some lenses with higher optical performance than is possible with the Sony E mount "narrow" lens throat diameter.

This aside those needing a more compact system now are unlikely to choose Sony, Nikon, Canon or Panasonic 24x36 ML format.
JJGEE 14 7.6k 18 England
11 Apr 2019 9:51PM

Quote:Many enthusiast photographers are age 55+

I am one of those Smile


Quote: and trade to smaller format ML to save weight,

But, I am not one of those..... I like and fortunately can still manage with the heavier camera Smile
LenShepherd 11 4.0k United Kingdom
12 Apr 2019 8:11AM

Quote:
Quote:Many enthusiast photographers are age 55+

I am one of those Smile


Quote: and trade to smaller format ML to save weight,

But, I am not one of those..... I like and fortunately can still manage with the heavier camera Smile


I am well over 55.
While I can now carry less weight for less longer distances I can still easily accommodate the larger size of 24x36 (a backpack is one solution) for its higher quality and wider range of accessories/lenses.
Specifically Nikon lenses like the Nikon 70-300 P, 300PF and 500PF can help when walking longer distances, as can a Z 7 body. I know you can use these lenses on other systems via adaptors though with some loss of AF speed and VR performance which, to me, makes no sense at the high price point.
There are more weight saving choices with higher optical quality than even 12 months ago.


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