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Bird Feeder

Taken with my Tamron 70-200mm lens and 7DII. I adjusted microfocus.
In a previous upload it was indicated that the lens had a problem that was thought to perhaps be from having the VC on with such a high shutter speed.. Or maybe it was me.
I ran the Camera/Lens through Focal and re-did the uAdjustment.
I took this picture from my back porch leaning on the rail. VC is on.
This seems to me to be spot on. My focus point is the birds eye and beak.
I uploaded an unprocessed version of the Raw file converted to jpeg by Canon's DPP4
I am interested in more experienced opinions. Is there still camera/lens shake?

Tags: Bird Bird feeder Back yard Wildlife and nature


banehawi Plus
16 2.2k 4149 Canada
23 Apr 2018 6:43PM
Was VC on or off?

How much adjustment did you need to use, and was it + or - adjustments?

The image you mentioned had nothing to do with focus. It was a VC issue. In my experience with my lens, I would occasionally get a good fast shutter shot with VC on, - but it was inconsistent. VC off produced tack sharp image every single time. As Tamron states, VC may not work as expected under some circumstances, so I would always turn it off, and enable it only with slow shutter speeds.

What you need to do is post two shots of the same subject, something like this, one with VC on and one with it off, and identify them here.



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4 31 1 United States
23 Apr 2018 7:21PM
Hi Willie,
I ran it through Focal because aside from doing microadjustment, it can identify other issues with a lens.
At telephoto I am now at +8 on the 7DII.
With this shot, VC was on.
I have some shots of inanimate objects, both VC on and off. I will post them.
femape 3 Argentina
23 Apr 2018 9:09PM
dudler Plus
17 1.2k 1679 England
24 Apr 2018 7:03AM
As Willie says, in terms of your technical problems, the only way is to work through the options and take comparison shots. Probably a good few, to be sure that you're drawing conclusions from the right data, and not exceptional or outlying results.

On a pictorial tack, notice how the out-of-focus structure blocks the bird, visually. If a defocussed foreground isn't acting as a frame, it is usually a distraction.
paulbroad 13 131 1289 United Kingdom
24 Apr 2018 3:35PM
Quite honestly, having VC on should make no actual difference at all if the shutter speed is fast. Why would It? I usually leave stabilisation on all the time on a modern lens and it makes no difference to image quality at fast shutter speeds in a negative fashion or using a tripod.

You are shooting at near full aperture, not ideal. You should try and be at f8 or so - f5.6 to f11 is likely to give best results optically. You should try and have ISO as low as is practical. Even with modern gear, high ISO, lower quality.

Here, the birds eye is, indeed the sharpest area, but it is still slightly off. That could easily be the wide aperture, high ISO or a bit of both.I would be very careful messing with the auto focus settings on the camera.

The only way to test focus is using a tripod and a test target - a flat page of text will do. Get the exposure right, then expose at a series of apertures and focal lengths, noting each setting. If you do not carefully record each group of settings, your tests will be worthless.

I think you might be better doing some tests at ISO200 and f8!

dudler Plus
17 1.2k 1679 England
24 Apr 2018 4:36PM
That is a very sound suggestion from Paul - do some tests on a static subject in good light. Will the lens perform well in ideal conditions?

And - as Willie suggests - the tests must include with VR on and off. He said there's a known issue with this type of lens, and that is therefore a cause to check and work on.
4 31 1 United States
25 Apr 2018 12:48AM
Hi Everyone,
Greetings from Southern Florida. I wish I was able to bring my camera/lenses with me.
I intentionally shot at f/2.8 to analyze the out of focus background. Willie noted in my initial deer photo that the bokeh looked weird.

The versions are pictures of static images, one with VC on and one with VC off. They are noted as such.
The picture of the flowers hand held look worse with VC on!
I don't get it.

4 31 1 United States
25 Apr 2018 12:54AM
Hi Paul,
I use Focal to do the micro adjustment. The camera was on a tripod, the 3 legs retracted. The center pole was 1/3 extended and I used the target that comes with the Focal software. I made sure the Tripod head was level to the ground. The tests were done outside in my drivway as I do not have the space or lighting indoors.
The 7D MkII allows for wide and telephoto settings.

4 31 1 United States
25 Apr 2018 12:56AM
Hi John,
The photo was not submitted for it's composition. I asking for help to diagnose if I indeed have an issue. If I do, is it the lens or is it me.

Is there a more appropriate place to post such pictures and ask for help?
dudler Plus
17 1.2k 1679 England
25 Apr 2018 6:00PM
This is the right place to ask for technical help, though you may also get a response from the forums.

My comment about composition is there because it's true, and although it's not pertinent to you question, it may be of relevance to novices who are scanning through the Critique Gallery.

To my eye, the VC is doing very little for you, and may be having an adverse effect. After downloading your four additional pictures and looking at the EXIF data and sharpness on screen, I have a couple of extra thoughts.

First, all four were shot at 1/800 second and full aperture: that's a speed that should ensure that VC isn't very necessary. Shooting at slower speeds, where you would really expect to get camera shake will tell you more.

Closing down the aperture would give that, and also eliminate the risk of focus error: good scientific procedure is to go after one problem at a time. I know you have doubts about the focus accuracy, so making sure it's not affecting the results will be helpful.

The daffodil is not a great subject, as the slightest breeze may give subject movement, and that will matter if you are using a lower shutter speed. A brick wall is a really good subject for tests like this - apart from anything lese, it has plenty of detail, and straight lines which will be good for identifying blur in either plane.

Finally, for handheld shots, you need to take a good number, and average out the results. Don't rely on a single example, as it may be an 'outlier' - not representative of what normally happens. If you have twelve shots which show a consistent fault (or which are consistently Good) yo ucan draw conclusions with some confidence. You may well have done this, I realise, but you haven't told us that you have, so it is worth pointing out, just in case.
4 31 1 United States
25 Apr 2018 8:26PM
Thanks John,
I was intentionally taking just single shots, hoping that just taking single shots would eliminate any shake that would come by putting the camera on rapid fire and holding it longer.

I will find a brick wall this weekend, take a bunch of shots handheld & at f/4-6 and look at the results.
Would you advise using a tripod instead, even though I shoot with this lens exclusively handheld? Remember I am looking for Lens IQ, possible interference from a faulty VC, and/or poor shooting technique.

dudler Plus
17 1.2k 1679 England
26 Apr 2018 6:09AM
George, I was not suggesting continuous shooting, but a series of individual single-shot images.

The crucial thing is the shutter speed, so use aperture settings that let you explore speeds that are likely to need VC.

Do tests on one potential problem at a time - so do the VC tests handheld (that's what VC is for).

Then do a separate series of tests for simple quality. Do these on a tripod, with VC switched off, at various apertures. A brick wall is a good subject for these, too, as you can see detail to the corners of the image.

Technique - feet apart, elbows tucked in, breathe out just before you release the shutter, and don't delay between focussing and taking the picture. Human beings keep their balance by swaying slightly, and this can be enough to throw off carefully-set focus with long lenses and wide apertures. Treat the camera the way a sniper treats a rifle, not the way an actor uses a machine gun.

I'd also suggest two completely opposite approaches.

First, do some reading. Get an old-fashioned photography manual - something like the Ilford Manual of Photography, and read up on the theory. Then find updated material that deals with AF and digital. But make sure you have a solid grounding in the optics and physics.

And, on the opposite side, remember it's all about the results. If those are satisfactory, and meet your needs, just take pictures and enjoy them. A lot of people - and all of us occasionally - have crises when we lose confidence, when nothign is good enough, when we chase too many solutions to too many problems.
4 31 1 United States
26 Apr 2018 1:05PM
"Human beings keep their balance by swaying slightly, and this can be enough to throw off carefully-set focus with long lenses and wide apertures". I had not considered this! Would this be an argument for not using back button focus?

Thank you John, Willie and Paul for your guidance and teaching.
There really isn't any substitute for experience.

Thanks everyone.

dudler Plus
17 1.2k 1679 England
27 Apr 2018 9:00PM
I don't think it is a reason not to use back button focus, but it is a consideration when you do use it. If you're handholding, long lens, wide aperture, close to the subject, it means don't focus and do somethign else and then take the picture. Do focus and shoot immediately - a second could be far too long to delay..
4 31 1 United States
29 Apr 2018 5:50PM
Thank you John,

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