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Nature's Decay

By ctxuk  
Using an old Tokina 70-210 f4.5-f32 AF 745 (beer can) Announced in 1989 Discontinued in 1990 produced for only a couple of years due to the switch to Digital from Film and focus changes. I have a recollection of seeing the lens on Points West back then and the Tokina spokes person saying it was the best lens they had produced to date but due to changes in camera design it was useless as it would not operate with new camera bodies.
AF does not work, nor do the sensor couplings, everything has to be performed on the lens manually. I attached a filter holder ring to lens front to make focusing easier, the tiny focus ring a non starter (presumes they expected everyone to use AF)
I will put a couple of other images as variations to give a more full idea of the lens abilities. The rose shot using a Nikon PK 12 attached also.
Shot fully manual.
Looking for thoughts on the lens and images it produces. Is it a useful lens, or would getting a more up to date model be a better idea? Lens bought at a reasonable price and in good condition.
So any suitable thoughts, comments appreciated.

https://tokinalens.com/product/af_745/

Tags: Landscape and travel tokina 765

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Comments


dudler Plus
18 1.7k 1877 England
14 Jul 2021 4:23PM
There seems to be quite a lot of flare in the versions, where the sun isn't behind the camera... Are you using a lens hood on it? If not, that might transform the performance.

All the shots seem decently sharp. Deeper analysis would depend on seeing sectional crops of different parts of the field.

And I agree - early AF lenses had pathetic manual focus rings - the newest lenses, with their 'fly-by-wire' system are both easier to use, and have far better 'feel' - almost comparable with a good MF lens. The idea of fitting a filter holder to the front element to provide grip is inspired.

dark_lord Plus
17 2.8k 784 England
14 Jul 2021 5:30PM
The isue with the lead image, and much more so with Version 1 is overexposure. The highlights have gone in the rose.
As for the main image you may be able to pull some back from the RAW file - it's useful to see the unadjusted jpg here but that's still a jpg so trying a mpod on it won't help in that respect.
Version 3 is much more pleasing as it's in less contrasty light.
Version 2 is typical of overhead light at this time of year when looking at a view from a distance

That's a strange reason for discontinuing, digital cameras didn't make a big impact on the market until well over a decade later. Similaly with the 'new' camera bodies as all the major manufacturers had well established AF mounts by then which weren't changing.

But it means you've got a decent value secondhand buy.

Certainly at the size on here sharpness appears good, the lead image is well detailed so if you're ok with the manual operations there's no reason to rush to change.
mrswoolybill Plus
14 2.9k 2457 United Kingdom
14 Jul 2021 6:36PM
V1 and V3 are the images that I am looking at, they show sharpness where it matters plus very pleasing bokeh in the background. They are overexposed, and looking at V1 I wonder what time of day it was taken. The light does not look kind for flower photography...

Re the main upload - sort out exposure then move in and look for compositions. The kit is the starting point. Test it out creatively.
Moira
ctxuk Plus
12 18 3 England
14 Jul 2021 6:43PM
It is funny bit when I last did a search for the lens I spent ages looking to find little info. Knowing now its true name I found some good detailed info, it seemingly is very good just as Tokina stated.

dudler
No place to fit one with the filter holder ring to aid focusing but Tokina SH-553 snap on is the one for it, if I can find one that is. As I was shooting into the morning sun then a hood would have been a large benefit imo.

dark_lord

Quote:Version 3 is much more pleasing as it's in less contrasty light.

Shot at 07.57am, into the morning Sun but with myself stood upright so more over the rose in effect although at a couple of metres perhaps distance at most.

Quote:Version 2 is typical of overhead light at this time of year when looking at a view from a distance

Shot at 08.35am, I was shooting at right angles to the Sun pretty much (the supposed ideal?)

Quote:The isue with the lead image, and much more so with Version 1 is overexposure.

The lead image shows no blown areas at all on sooc. It was shot with the Sun behind myself.
Version 1 was shot with myself squatting down again around a couple metres distance perhaps, the angle though at almost 90 degrees to the bloom as I was on the downwards side of a slope. The morning Sun was behind it at around 08.20am and in effect I was shooting more into the Sun at that angle. I agree the dew highlights were overexposed although mostly the shot itself was not. At least camera raw sorts such things out a little.

I kind of enjoy Manual photography although in honesty for more stationary targets, forget birds in flight etc. AF is a boon although not having the fresnal split image of film days in the viewfinder means it is not as easy. Watching that 'dot' illuminate does work but distracting in many ways to composition, light etc. Often I just 'look' and evaluate when I think it is sharp with a manual lens (I did this with the Version 2).

The Fuji S5 Pro has a motor in the body and the standard Nikon screw type fitment for focus, All I can think is the lens fitment placement does not correspond. Nothing on the present contacts works via body dials to change aperture.
As I said, I recall it, I was visiting my parents home and it came up on the local swest news program. I didn't even own a camera then having given up after lending my new one out so a pal could photograph his newborn to get it back broken, film winder gone (he was only 16/17 himself, as was I, figured do him a favour so he could have memories for the future. After that I stopped for a long time lending things out, the next was an electric guitar, I never did get that back. It though made me cease photography for 25 years or more) .So, for some reason I took note of what the person said about it and when I saw this on ebay figured had to be worth a punt, it was not expensive at all but no caps for it or hood.
ctxuk Plus
12 18 3 England
14 Jul 2021 6:57PM
mrswoolybill
See my last post for times of each image.

The main image really just a test shot as it has useful features in to analyse the image ... or so I thought. In my ACR it sooc as a raw does not reach either the white point, just short, or the black point, markedly further away to the point I would adjust immediately. The blacks in the image though are strong, as too shadow areas, coupled with the left side distant hills (well over a mile away over the large wide river) which are not badly hazy washed out but give depth and indicate focal clarity.

I am not sure if it is my own opinion or something others have noticed, but these old lens have in many ways a more pleasing softer quality. Newer lens are really sharp, images very detailed, more than the eye would see if there perhaps.
ctxuk Plus
12 18 3 England
14 Jul 2021 7:01PM
I added as Modification 3 the sooc jpeg file produced by the camera. No adjustments made at all.
banehawi Plus
17 2.5k 4264 Canada
14 Jul 2021 7:53PM
Its hazy and lacks contrast. This may not be attributable entirely to the lens, - its not unlike some previous images from the camera using different lenses, though this is a little more exaggerated.

The better performing a lens is, the better the contrast, which is improved by lens coatings, reducing flare and reflections, etc. in addition to just sharpness. Tokina make good lenses overall, their main forte though is in wide angle lenses, and wide angle zooms.

Ive uploaded a mod with the black point set lower, haze reduced and a touch warmer. It responds well to post processing.


Regards


Willie
dudler Plus
18 1.7k 1877 England
14 Jul 2021 8:46PM
Following on... How about using the lens hood as the focus assistance? I think it's fairly clear that the lens really needs one.

Keith pointed out an anomaly that I'd missed: virtually all digital cameras are post-2000, so the reason for Tokina to discontinue in 1990 can't have been anything to do with that...
ctxuk Plus
12 18 3 England
14 Jul 2021 10:38PM
dudler

Quote:How about using the lens hood as the focus assistance? I think it's fairly clear that the lens really needs one.

Only one on fleabay is in Russia with postage as much almost. I may cobble up some form of attachment to that filter holder ring as it appears they are only around an inch deep.


Quote:Keith pointed out an anomaly that I'd missed: virtually all digital cameras are post-2000, so the reason for Tokina to discontinue in 1990 can't have been anything to do with that...

No idea, I go on a memory from 30 years ago. Nikon F mount though was designed in 1959, you can use extremely old lens and have them work although electronic couplings may not the AF screw drive should. I wasn't even using a camera back then having stopped when my new loaned out one was returned broken years before, it was not until 2004 or 2006 I began using a camera again.

banehawi


Quote:This may not be attributable entirely to the lens, - its not unlike some previous images from the camera using different lenses, though this is a little more exaggerated.

That suggest to me you think camera issue, operator or editing error. As there is the sooc jpeg as mod 3 can you be more specific your thoughts as to which please?


Quote:It responds well to post processing.

It is interesting to compare your, dark_lord's and my own images. Yours is yellower, more contrast darker but more open shadows to his bluer, dense shadows that are not so open. The version I presented sits between the sooc jpeg and both of yours somewhat with less contrast. It may be useful to try with some form of colour chart in the image of known value quantities.


Quote:Tokina make good lenses overall, their main forte though is in wide angle lenses, and wide angle zooms.

The couple I have of theirs seem well made etc albeit manual. I was interested in their 300mm f2.8 Pro, it seems a shame they decided to move out of that sector of the market as its reportedly pretty good at a lot less than the admittedly better Nikon 300mm f2.8's. I never seem to have the cash to purchase a good used one, always something else required or would have done so by now.
ctxuk Plus
12 18 3 England
15 Jul 2021 10:02AM
Versions 4 - 15 Raw processed then sooc jpeg follows it. D700 on manual and auto wb

I have uploaded images shot today with the Tokina 745 and a faulty D700, please excuse the ridiculous sensor crud which i attempted to remove on the raw processed versions I did, Not happy with some of the processing in honesty, the last rose for instance I noticed that I brightened considerably and not sure its correct to the plant really.
Same plant, views buildings. Light is though cloud covered and more diffuse as a result of that, gone the bright morning light of yesterday with little cloud cover. Shot around same time of day.

I would be interested to hear Willie's view on them considering his shared thoughts here "Its hazy and lacks contrast. This may not be attributable entirely to the lens, - its not unlike some previous images from the camera using different lenses, though this is a little more exaggerated", his replies may indicate much.

My opinion that I miss my d700, it performs well with the lens. Shutter does not flip mirror up/down correctly and it jams, I wouldn't go out with it to use as it often won't, but sometimes will, last night it worked almost flawlessly, today, it jammed several times in 25 or so shots..
I stopped using the D700 body some time back because of this.
dark_lord Plus
17 2.8k 784 England
15 Jul 2021 8:00PM
Your processed images of the rose look fine.

Versions 18 and 19 look alright too. They would benefit from being a little warmer (I think most people would) but if you're happy with them than that's ok.
ctxuk Plus
12 18 3 England
15 Jul 2021 8:34PM
dark_lord
firstly, ty for looking again and your reply


Quote:but if you're happy with them than that's ok.

That in many ways is something any artist would understand, although perhaps many are alike myself and self critical and rarely happy with end results finding at least something not quite right.
The point to the new images is banehawi's comment

Quote:This may not be attributable entirely to the lens, - its not unlike some previous images from the camera using different lenses, though this is a little more exaggerated.

This obviously leads me to wonder about equipment, use or what as an individual I find to be 'correct' in processing, I realised from past advice he is very knowledgeable and to say such I ought examine the advice and images.
I analyse my photography (and other interests) and 'work' at it rather than it is a hobby approach. Some understanding assists me to improve which comes from being that way.

version 18 even now I view the nettles and think too yellow and more contrast than the structures front boards.
version 19 i see a couple of the sensor marks on the grass slope every time I look but don't feel any need to make it warmer. The russet red leaves already a little too red and that pink rose stands out there also like a vivid marker pen just above the fence.

What I got as a surprise though is how good the lens performs on the D700, remember its faulty shutter so I hadn't used it in 2 years maybe so out of touch using one. Detail in the image shows the treeline around 1/2 mile or more has good detail under them and apart from a tiny bit of edge CA on extreme outer edges it performs well imo. These were the first time I used it on that body.

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