Back Modifications (8)
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The Meeting Points

By Selby
Hello, again – I did promised to send the Team an occasional image for a critique assessment – well your opinions on the previous picture made me aware that the fault, which I suffer, to be overprocessing an image.

The picture was taken in Aperture priority, yet I failed to use any exposure compensation at all, as the shot was taken hurriedly - due to looking backwards and seeing that the couple on the bench enhanced the scene but then I didn’t want them to be disturbed and moving their position, when seeing the camera was pointed in their direction.

This request is not just for a critique on processing, etc – it is also about composition of the picture, having only used a portion of the NEF file. Not criticizing my own picture – yet, very interested in any composition that of the Critique Team would, themselves, choose.

Modification 2 is a JPEG made directly from the NEF file and this allows for an understanding of the imaged captured. A waste bin has been removed in Mod 1 image – which confirms that my lack of processing skill is by its result - that the necessary coverup didn’t match with my expectation. ☹

The Critique Team were wonderful in their views on previous picture – thus, I am looking forward to receiving the Teams critiques on this occasion.


Tags: Landscape and travel Pathway alongside River Severn - Lydney Harbour in Glocestershire

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Comments


chase Plus
17 2.5k 665 England
29 Nov 2020 12:52PM
Hi Graham and welcome back to the CG.
I am not convinced that the composition works here, the general interest is on the left of the frame with nothing to really grab my attention on the other side.
So, in my mod, I concentrated on the are of interest and cropped away the rest.
This looks a little soft to me, could be down to some noise from the high ISO you have used and I am not quite sure where your focal point lies.
This looks very saturated in comparison to your original image and a little dark tbh.
In my mod ( I used your original image, raw to jpeg), as well as a hefty crop, I sharpened a touch, brightened and added a little more contrast.
I lightened that signpost on an adjustment layer with a mask so I could put the lightening where I thought it was needed.
I used the smaller post as an anchor to the right whilst cropping.
I quite like the sweep of the coastline and the conversation going on between the two Ladies.

Again, probably a touch over processed.
mrswoolybill Plus
16 3.5k 2563 United Kingdom
29 Nov 2020 12:52PM
Hello again. I do like it when we get asked interesting questions. But I'll get to composition in a moment...

First of all, you rushed the shot. And when you have sitting targets like this, there's no need... They are not going to move away, they are too deep in conversation. So the first thing is - check your settings. Even before you start looking at exposure compensation, check what may be left over from your previous shoot - here it was ISO 4000! Using aperture priority, you should still see that shutter speed, 1/3200 second, appear at the bottom of the screen; and in any normal daylight conditions 1/3200 second should ring major alarm bells!

It's a tricky scene because of the very bright patches in the sky. Did you have a longer lens with you? That would have allowed you to avoid including the brightest bits top right. Believe me, the way those ladies are talking you had time to change lens. Equally, shooting in Raw would give greater scope for improving the sky.

Wide angle is part of the problem composition-wise, there are so many things dragging the viewer's eyes one way and the other. The eye needs a clear route, with a destination to reach. And logically, that's the ladies, framed by the two wooden uprights - but then there's the curve of water beyond them. You did well to get rid of the rubbish bin, but I wanted to simplify further.

I've uploaded two crops based on your original - portrait to lead the eye upwards, square to contain the scene with the ladies. I also processed a bit lighter on the land and water, and reduced saturation on reds. I'm not really satisfied with the results but they are to present alternatives.
Moira
pamelajean Plus
16 1.8k 2275 United Kingdom
29 Nov 2020 4:49PM
I used your first version, Graham, the original, to do my own modification.

I cropped, maintaining your aspect ratio, removing a lot of the muddy foreground and placing your subjects, the girls on the bench, on a thirds intersection (see Rule Of Thirds ).

I straightened the image using the signpost, and cloned away the waste bin. I felt that your subjects would stand out better without the shrub behind them which is hiding their outlines, so I removed some of it.

I increased the saturation just a touch. I ran the burn brush over the right part of the sky before adjusting contrast and risking too much burn-out on the white parts. Then a bit of sharpening.

Pamela.
banehawi Plus
18 2.8k 4332 Canada
29 Nov 2020 5:23PM
Closer crop for sure; convert to sRGB when uploading, - this is Adobe; increase exposure. Looks like noise reduction is aggressive.

Mod uploaded with this done, and sharpened.


W
ctxuk 13 18 3 England
29 Nov 2020 9:30PM
A differing crop with an altered perspective. Ladies are on a third line. Kept the path to retain signpost sense and offer the idea of a crossroads, the River is apparently crossable on foot in places near there. Lightened to open it up, adjusted some hsl on various colours. Added some filter work. All done in PS and ACR. Mod from your original file.
I read other peoples comments after doing my mod and uploading it.
Edit. Something to be said for the vastness of this imo.
dudler Plus
19 2.0k 1966 England
30 Nov 2020 10:50AM
Moira did the stuff about camerawork, and being able to take your time setting up a shot. As I'm late to the party, I'll add something about wideangle lenses...

Often, the first thing that landscape photographers want to do is buy a lens that will 'get it all in' - and then they fail to fill the frame. It's interesting that a longer lens can often be better for capturing the telling details: your crop here is not a million miles from being the view an 85 would give...

So, as Moira says, be bold, and go in close, which is what a lot of street photographers do. A 24 allows you to shoot from the hip with a decent margin for error in your aim, especially if you practice a bit.
Selby 2 United Kingdom
30 Nov 2020 2:40PM
ctxuk - you was kind when mailing the differing crop with an altered perspective and I have viewed it - thank you.

My approach to the Critique Team was for them to study the composition of the picture submitted - also asking the Team to provide their version/s of the image for to judge.

Don't think unkindly of me, it is my view that the questions and answers are being solely dealt with by the Team and myself - therefore, other like yourself can read the mails and submit their own modification but none will infringe upon the the matter being discussed by the two parties.

Graham

Selby 2 United Kingdom
30 Nov 2020 2:54PM
Dudley, ones who are late to a party - have to give something to forgive for being such and you have done so.

On fitting 18-200mm DX to my Nikon D300s it rarely was changed - unless for the 70-400mm lens - thus I would have 24mm to use.

Graham
Selby 2 United Kingdom
1 Dec 2020 3:18AM
Chase, I agree with you that the composition of my picture does not work - as you’ve pointed out all of the main interest is to the left of the image. Yes, again, probably a touch over processed.
The ‘hefty crop’ certainly has done the trick - your completed image is pleasing to the eye – but …
Moira – you have certainly provided me with a constructive critique and is fully appreciated, it tells not only of my faults but also offers good advice to assist me in my future work as a photographer..
Hush-hush, a secret between us two 😊 – our son corrects settings to my camera, when at times I have played about with it. Unlike the CT, he does know my age, 87 years, and of having had a stroke in 2017 – this affects my speech, lack of knowing words and having no feel in the fingertips on the right (camera) hand. This information is just an explanation - not seeking symphony for I got off very lightly.
An example: Willie wrote ‘convert to sRGB’ – I did try but my memory failed to remember how to do such; fortunately, our son visited us this afternoon and he has taken me through the necessary procedure. ☹
Mod 2 takes in most of the general interest in the picture – yet it also gets a ‘but …’ same as given to Chase. Why is there a directional signpost alongside the only path, when only one is required at either end of the path?
Mod 3 this I do like as it is centred on the girls on the bench; also, it contains the second path to right which faces the signpost telling walkers which direction to take.
Pamela – Mod 5 – to me, landscape photography captures scenes of the local terrain with its physical character and can include people and man-made structures.
Your picture centres around the two ladies (they do stand out better without the shrub) and the man-made things – while the terrain and sky are the background but it is there for the eyes to see and so to form the landscape scene. Well thought out and a pleasure to view.
Willie – Mod 6 – the quality of your work is superb as I have discovered by my previous entered image and those seen in your Portfolio – this time the print is enhanced by the white border.
“Closer crop for sure” would be the choice of most judges and yours would impress them. My only comment is while there is a hint of a path to the right, I would prefer to see a little bit more.
Lack of sRGB colouring has been explained in my words to Moira.
Only recently changed over to RAW, it will take me time to learn – I joined to learn and decided to put images to the Critique Team for their opinions – and they are teaching me to observe my own work – couldn’t be better.
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Selby – Mod 8 – is my revised picture after viewing the ones produced by the CT .
Enjoyed my second session with the Critique Team – now after giving my details to Moira, to explain my wild ISO and shutter speeds, I do hope to be allow to submit further pictures.
Graham
mrswoolybill Plus
16 3.5k 2563 United Kingdom
1 Dec 2020 8:09AM
Hello again, thanks for coming back with a very detailed response. The important thing is that we have given you ideas to consider - mission accomplished, that I think is the main function of the Critique Gallery. It's also useful to know as much as possible about your personal circumstances in so far as they affect your activity, so thanks for the information.

Can I clear up one misunderstanding though:

Quote:My approach to the Critique Team was for them to study the composition of the picture submitted - also asking the Team to provide their version/s of the image for to judge.

Don't think unkindly of me, it is my view that the questions and answers are being solely dealt with by the Team and myself - therefore, other like yourself can read the mails and submit their own modification but none will infringe upon the the matter being discussed by the two parties.



A very important principle on this site is that all uploads are open to all members to critique. That includes Critique Gallery uploads! If you look at the very bottom of the page, the black Directory Pages section, there is a link to FAQs, and from this you can open a page of questions and answers on the CG. NB in particular:


Quote:Do I need to be a member of the critique team to offer comment?

Absolutely not. Although there is a critique team in place, to provide consistent comment, the whole idea of this gallery is to gain valuable insight and comment, from you, the member. The critique team will post alongside you with further comments and suggestions of their own of how to improve the photo.


We are trying to encourage other members to participate here, it's not a private club!
Regards,
Moira
pamelajean Plus
16 1.8k 2275 United Kingdom
1 Dec 2020 11:47AM
Thank you for your comprehensive feedback, Graham, it's always a pleasure to know we have helped in some way, and also if we have not.

As to non-Critique-Team-members contributing to this gallery, it is very much encouraged. There are people on this site who have extensive photographic knowledge but who do not have the time to commit to joining the Critique Team, but will occasionally offer their insight. We wouldn't want to deny them the opportunity to impart such knowledge to those seeking advice or help. Similarly, there will be those who see beyond the things that the Critique Team see, and who have unique ideas to impart. We on the team can also learn from these contributions, as well as you.

I hope you don't mind us correcting you on this. Several members read the Critique Gallery comments, even though they may not upload their own pictures or make comments, because they are keen to learn. So we wouldn't want them to think this is an exclusive part of the site.

Pamela.
dark_lord Plus
18 3.0k 835 England
1 Dec 2020 11:54AM
Thank you for your explanations Graham.

We encourage input from all members, as everyone's input is valid. This is especially so where someone has experience in a niche area or has encountered similar situations to an OP or, for example, is familiar with the locality of a landscape image.

As regards processing, you could consider writing down your workflow to prompt you. For example, you could have an 'epz upload' list that includes 'now convert to sRGB'.
Selby 2 United Kingdom
1 Dec 2020 1:38PM
Refreshed wording to previous mail to ctxuk - after reading Moira and Pamela mails
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"Quote": My approach to the Critique Team was for them to study the composition of the picture submitted - also asking the Team to provide their version/s of the image for to judge.

Don't think unkindly of me, it is my own view that the questions asked in the previous paragraph and their answers are being dealt with by the Team - therefore, others like yourself can read the mails and submit their own views and modifications - but none of those will infringe on my conclusion upon the matter being discussed by the two parties; as my decisions will be solely based on the advice offered, to me, by the Critique Team.
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chase Plus
17 2.5k 665 England
1 Dec 2020 3:55PM
Hi Graham and thank you for the insight into your photographic journey.

Some good advice and modifications can come from many directions here, not just the Critique Team, other members are actively encouraged to add constructive comments, modifications and different points of view,perhaps they see something very different to the Critique Team and consider an image with a different perspective and it would be a shame if those opinions were ignored.
Please try to keep an open mind.
I look forward to further images and conversations.
mrswoolybill Plus
16 3.5k 2563 United Kingdom
1 Dec 2020 4:56PM
Graham: It helps us if you let us know whether individual comments are helpful to you or not, that way we can tailor advice to your needs. But to dismiss out of hand advice from non-CT members is not helpful to anyone. I too hope that we shall see more uploads from you, and that you will consider all advice received.
Regards,
Moira
Selby 2 United Kingdom
2 Dec 2020 2:01PM
Quote – “I hope you don't mind us correcting you on this. Several members read the Critique Gallery comments, even though they may not upload their own pictures or make comments, because they are keen to learn. So we wouldn't want them to think this is an exclusive part of the site.” Pamela
Think! – Not at all, Pamela, others have done such – I have read some of Critique Gallery comments and so ask what CT action is made when, like ctxuk, they upload their own picture? After all it was a conversation between involved people on the same subject – so what action was taken by any of the CT members?
ctxuk uploaded his picture at 9.30pm on 29th Nov. - I wrote my reply to ctxuk at 2.40pm on 30th Nov. – My conclusion to the subject was in a written response to the CT members and this was mailed at 1.30am on 1st December. Later that morning, yours and Moira’s politely told of my mistake.
I had written to ctxuk, politely, and thanked him for uploading his image - although I could not say, honestly, that I would consider it. Having asked and requested the CT Members to provide their images as they were acknowledged photographers – I had no idea as to his status in photograph.
At 2.40pm on the 1st Dec. – the only action by a CT Member on ctxuk upload, took place – when dark_lord mail came stating,”ctxuk input is valid. This is especially so where someone has experience in a niche area or has encountered similar situations to an OP or, for example, is familiar with the locality of a landscape image.“
Think! How often has any CT Member referred to in connection to another ones upload?
Pamela, I have made another mistake, today, having uploaded a photo - Over the Boundary Fence - with sound settings – you may wish to confirm by boast.
Graham

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